[CALL MEETING TO ORDER]
[00:00:04]
WE'VE GOT KIND OF A FULL HOUSE TONIGHT, RELATIVELY SPEAKING.
UM, THANKS TO THOSE WHO ARE JOINING IN PERSON THANKS TO, UH, THOSE WHO ARE JOINING US ONLINE.
IT IS 6:04 PM I'M CALLING THIS, UH, MEETING OF THE RESOURCE MANAGEMENT COMMISSION TO ORDER.
UM, WE HAVE A DECEPTIVELY LONG AGENDA TODAY.
[PUBLIC COMMUNICATION: GENERAL]
FIRST ORDER OF BUSINESS IS, UH, PUBLIC SPEAKERS.I UNDERSTAND WE DO HAVE SOME FOLKS SIGNED UP TO SPEAK.
WE HAVE FOUR PEOPLE SIGNED UP.
DO WE NEED A ROLL CALL FIRST? OH, DO WE NEED A ROLL CALL? MY, I DON'T KNOW.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE RULE IS.
GOOD EVENING, CHAIR DAVIS, CHAIR, VICE CHAIR, ROBBINS, AND COMMISSIONERS.
I'M AL BRADEN, A DISTRICT SEVEN VOTER.
I'M CONCERNED WITH THE OPERATION AND RATES AND PROGRAMS OF TEXAS GAS SERVICE THAT YOU'LL BE HEARING ABOUT THIS EVENING.
THE NEGOTIATIONS OVER A POSSIBLE NEW TEXAS GRASS GAS SERVICE FRANCHISE REPRESENT A 20 YEAR, ONCE IN A GENERATION OPPORTUNITY TO BETTER ALIGN THE VALUES AND EXPECTATIONS OF OUR GAS UTILITY WITH THE CITIZENS OF AUSTIN, WHILE STILL PROVIDING A STABLE PROFIT FOR THE UTILITY.
OVER DECADES OF PUBLIC ENGAGEMENT, AUSTIN HAS ALIGNED THE RATES AND PROGRAMS OF OUR PUBLIC ELECTRIC AND WATER UTILITIES TO MEET THOSE NEEDS.
THESE INCLUDE A MODEST MONTHLY CONNECTION FEE TO HELP LOW INCOME USERS, A PROGRESSIVE RATE STRUCTURE DESIGNED TO HELP LOW VOLUME USERS AND ENCOURAGE CONSERVATION.
A PROGRAM OF ASSISTANCE TO INCOME QUALIFIED LOW INCOME USERS IN THE CAP PROGRAM, INCENTIVES AND REBATES FOR WEATHERIZATION, ENERGY EFFICIENCY, AND THE PURCHASE OF ENERGY EFFICIENT HVAC SYSTEMS AND APPLIANCES.
CONNECTION FEES FOR NEW USERS CAPTURE THE FULL COST OF CONNECTION RATHER THAN SPREADING IT ACROSS ALL USERS.
AND OUR UTILITIES HAVE CARBON REDUCTION PLANS THAT ARE QUITE AGGRESSIVE AND AIM TO ELIMINATE CARBON FROM OUR ELECTRIC GENERATION BY 2035.
UH, WE ALSO CONTRIBUTE THAT UTILITY.
THE ELECTRIC UTILITY CONTRIBUTES 10% TO THE CITY GENERAL FUND AND CONTRACTS TO THE CURRENT MINIMAL 5% FRANCHISE FEE WITH TEXAS GAS.
AS YOU'LL SEE TONIGHT, TEXAS GAS SERVICES RATES AND PROGRAMS, AS THEY PRESENTLY OPERATE IN AUSTIN, ARE THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF AUSTIN'S DESIRED RATES AND PROGRAMS. ROUGHLY 230,000 TEXAS GAS SERVICE CUSTOMERS IN AUSTIN REPRESENT ABOUT A THIRD OF ALL THE CUSTOMERS THAT THE UTILITY SERVES IN TEXAS.
YET WE ARE ALL LUMPED TOGETHER IN ONE MASSIVE RATE SETTING CASE THAT INCLUDES EVERYONE FROM PORT ARTHUR TO GALVESTON TO CURO TO MARBLE FALLS TO AUSTIN.
WE HAVE LITTLE TO SAY IN SETTING RATES AND PROGRAMS, AND IT SKEWS OUR RATES HIGHER AS A RESULT TO GAIN INFLUENCE IN SETTING RATES, PROGRAMS AND SERVICES FOR AUSTIN CUSTOMERS.
I BELIEVE IT IS IMPORTANT TO ESTABLISH THIS NEW FRANCHISE AGREEMENT WHERE WE NEGOTIATE INDEPENDENTLY OF THE OTHER CUSTOMERS ACROSS THE STATE AND WORK TO PARTICIPATE IN OUR OWN RATE CASE.
ONLY THEN CAN WE TAILOR THOSE RATES AND PROGRAMS SIMILAR TO OUR OTHER CITY UTILITIES.
THIS IS NOT TO SAY THAT TEXAS GAS SERVICE CANNOT OR WILL NOT EARN A JUST PROFIT.
THE NEW RATES AND PROGRAMS CAN BE ACCURATELY COSTED AND PRESENTED IN A RATE CASE FOR FURTHER AD JUDIFICATION, TEXAS GAS SERVICE TO OUR EXISTING CUSTOMERS IS IMPORTANT, AND THIS WOULD JUST RESHAPE THE RATES AND PROGRAMS TO BETTER SERVE THEM CONSISTENT WITH OUR OTHER UTILITIES.
ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS FOR THE SPEAKER FROM THE COMMISSIONERS? THANK YOU.
NEXT UP, NEXT SPEAKER IS CRAIG NAZER.
AND AFTER CRAIG IS SHANE JOHNSON
HELLO, CRAIG NASER, CONSERVATION CHAIR, AUSTIN REGIONAL GROUP AND LONE STAR CHAPTER OF THE SIERRA CLUB.
I'M A LONGTIME CUSTOMER OF AUSTIN ENERGY BY CHOICE.
MY ELECTRICAL RATES ARE SOME OF THE BEST IN THE STATE, AND I HAVE KEPT THEM EVEN LOWER BY TAKING ADVANTAGE OF MANY ENERGY SAVING INVESTMENTS, SOME OFFERED BY THE UTILITY.
THIS HAS BEEN GOOD FOR ME, GOOD FOR THE CITY, AND GOOD FOR THE ENVIRONMENT.
I'M ALSO LONGTIME CUSTOMER OF TEXAS GAS SERVICE, NOT BY CHOICE, BUT BECAUSE THEY'RE A MONOPOLY.
MY RATES ARE RAPIDLY RISING DESPITE ANY KIND OF ENERGY SAVING INVESTMENTS I MAY MAKE.
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THIS IS BECAUSE TEXAS GAS SERVICE OWNS THE PIPES AND BECAUSE THE RAILROAD COMMISSION, WHICH HAS NOTHING WHATSOEVER TO DO WITH RAILROADS, IS FINE WITH NOT REALLY REGULATING THE MONOPOLY.IF AUSTIN OWNED THE PIPES, WE COULD HAVE COMPETITIVE RATES IN ORDER TO MAINTAIN THIS MONOPOLY.
TEXAS GAS SERVICE HIKES OUR GAS RATES TO INVEST IN MORE PIPES TO MAKE THE MONOPOLY LARGER.
MEANWHILE, TEXAS IS HARVESTING MORE NATURAL GAS THAN EVER.
IN FACT, GAS IS SO CHEAP AT THE WELLHEAD, THEY JUST FLARE SOME OF IT OFF AS IT IS APPARENTLY NOT WORTH ENOUGH TO CONSERVE AND MUCH WORSE LEAKING, FLARING, AND BURNING.
THIS GAS IS DRIVING CLIMATE CHANGE AS WELL AS AIR POLLUTION, BOTH IN OUR HOMES AND OUTDOORS IN OUR CITIES, AND EVEN SOMETIMES ACROSS THE COUNTRYSIDE.
TEXAS GAS SERVICES INVESTED MONEY IN LOBBYING AGAINST BUILDING CODES THAT WOULD PROVIDE COMPETITION.
RECENTLY, I CONVERTED AN OLD WORN OUT GAS WATER HEATER TO AN ELECTRIC ONE.
UNFORTUNATELY, THERE WAS NO 240 VOLT LINE IN THE WATER HEATER CLOSET THAT COST ME $2,000.
I FIGURED THAT WILL PAY ITSELF OFF IN SIX YEARS, BUT I HAD TO HAVE THAT MONEY UP FRONT.
TEXAS GAS SERVICE CONTINUES TO LOBBY AGAINST REQUIRING SUCH ELECTRIC LINES NEXT TO THE REQUIRED GAS LINES AND TEXAS BUILDING CODES.
THIS LEADS TO A WEALTHY TEXAS GAS SERVICE AND AN UNAFFORDABLE AUSTIN.
THIS COMMISSION HAS A CHOICE AS TO WHICH OF THOSE ENTITIES YOU WILL SUPPORT.
PLEASE VOTE TO PUT AS MANY CONSTRAINTS ON THE TEXAS GAS SERVICE MONOPOLY AS POSSIBLE.
TWO OF MY FAVORITES ARE ONE, REQUIRING TEXAS GAS SERVICE TO REPORT YEARLY ON HOW MUCH RATE PAYER MONEY THEY'RE SPENDING ON ENLARGING THEIR MONOPOLY.
AND TWO, TAKING THE MONEY, THE ENERGY CONSERVATION PROGRAM OUT OF THE HANDS OF TEXAS GAS SERVICE AND GIVING IT TO SOMEONE WHO WILL USE THAT MONEY TO ACTUALLY HELP CUSTOMERS CONSERVE ENERGY.
BUT WE WILL SUPPORT ALMOST ANYTHING THAT HELPS REDUCE CA COSTS FOR RATE PAIRS AND MOVES AUSTIN TOWARDS A RENEWABLE ENERGY FUTURE.
WE HAVE JUST ONE EARTH AND OUR ONLY HOME IN A VERY COLD UNIVERSE COULD REALLY USE OUR HELP RIGHT NOW.
NEXT SPEAKER IS SHANE JOHNSON, AND THEN KIBA WHITE IS WORTH NOTING.
IT'S WORTH NOTING THAT, UH, SHANE JOHNSON AND KABA WHITE WERE FORMERLY MEMBERS OF THIS COMMISSION.
UM, GO AHEAD AND START MY TIMER.
I'M HERE, UH, REPRESENTING THE TEXAS SIERRA CLUB AND, UH, ON, IN TERMS OF THE TEXAS GAS SERVICE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT, UH, AND RELATED ISSUES, UM, OF COURSE, UH, AND A BUILDING ON WHAT WAS PREVIOUSLY SAID.
RE UH, BUILDING ON WHAT WAS PREVIOUSLY SAID, UM, THE FREQUENTLY, THERE HAVE BEEN FREQUENTLY INCREASING RATES, UM, YOU KNOW, EVEN IN THE LAST COUPLE YEARS, INCREASING ON UNAFFORDABLE FUEL COSTS.
UM, A POORLY PERFORMING ENERGY CONSERVATION PROGRAM, UH, AND NO SUBSTANTIVE PLAN TO CUT CARBON FOR OVERALL BY TEXAS GAS SERVICE.
UM, AND THERE'S YET TO BE, UH, PROGRAMS THAT REALLY SUPPORT LOW AND MODERATE INCOME RATE PAYERS.
UH, AND SO WE SUPPORT, UH, RESOLUTIONS OR, OR, UM, POLICY CHANGES THAT WOULD CORRECT, UH, THAT ISSUE HELP, UH, SUPPORT, UH, AND PROVIDE GREATER BILL ASSISTANCE FOR LOW AND MODERATE INCOME, UH, RATE PAYERS.
UM, UH, IT'S EXTREMELY IMPORTANT AS I KNOW EVERYONE ON THE COMMISSION KNOWS THAT AND, AND HAVE SPOKEN IN DEPTH ABOUT THAT.
UM, AND SO, UH, ADDITIONALLY I WANT TO TO HIGHLIGHT THAT, UM, THE FACT THAT AUSTIN G AND AUSTIN WATER, UH, WHEN THEY, UM, IMPLEMENTED POLICY IN THE PAST AND CHANGED IT SO THAT THEY WERE, UM, UH, FULLY COLLECTING PAYMENT FOR NEW INFRASTRUCTURE, IT, IT CAUSED RATE DECREASES.
SO I THINK THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE C SHOULD CERTAINLY AIM FOR, UM, AND, UH, IS PARTICULARLY COMPELLING GIVEN THE REGRESSIVE RATE STRUCTURE AND HOW AS THINGS CURRENTLY STAND.
UH, ADDITIONALLY, UH, FORCING THE ISSUE OF, I THINK, UH, IMPROVED CONSERVATION PROGRAMS AND, AND THESE THINGS TO, UH, THE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT.
UM, IT, IT, THE CONSERVATION PROGRAM SPECIFICALLY TO ENCOURAGE APPLIANCES AND, AND RUN IT IN A WAY THAT REDUCES GAS USE INSTEAD OF JUST SORT OF, UM, MARKETING
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NEW APPLIANCES, UH, AS WELL AS WE'D BE IN FAVOR OF A, A 10 YEAR, UM, FRANCHISE AGREEMENT PERIOD, IF THAT'S POSSIBLE.UH, AND THEN I'LL ALSO SPEAK AS, UH, MORE ON O GI AND THE RATE ISSUES OR, OR RATES, UH, UM, IN ADDITION TO, TO, TO THE TEXAS GAS SERVICE.
AND SO, UM, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT GONNA DIVE, I'M NOT GONNA DIVE INTO SPECIFICS, UH, FROM THE RESOLUTION ON THIS.
UH, BUT THE SIERRA CLUB WAS A PARTY IN PREVIOUS RATE CASES, AS I'M SURE MOST OF YOU KNOW.
UH, AND THE, AND WE CAME TO AN AGREEMENT IN THE PAST WITH LOSS ENERGY TO PHASE IN THE RATE, UH, THE, FOR THE LAST RATE CASE, I SHOULD SAY.
WE CAME TO AN AGREEMENT TO PHASE IT, IT IN OVER THREE YEARS.
UH, AND NOW
SO WE SUPPORT, UH, FREEZING ADDITIONAL RATE INCREASES AND INSTEAD CONDUCTING A RATE STUDY THIS YEAR, FOLLOWED BY A PARTICIP PROCESS TO DETER, TO DETERMINE RATES AND RATE DESIGN.
KABA WHITE, AND I'M SPEAKING ON BEHALF OF PUBLIC CITIZENS TEXAS OFFICE.
BUT, UH, AS PAUL MENTIONED, I DID PREVIOUSLY SERVE ON THE RESOURCE MANAGEMENT COMMISSION AND JUST WANTED TO SHARE A LITTLE BIT OF PERSPECTIVE AS IT PERTAINS TO THE TEXAS GAS ISSUES.
UM, I CAN SAY WE ARE SUPPORTIVE IN GENERAL OF THE RESOLUTIONS THAT HAVE BEEN PUT FORWARD ON THIS ITEM.
UM, THE ONE THAT I WOULD MAYBE NOT BE SO SUPPORTIVE OF IS, IS SPECIFICALLY ENCOURAGING THE CITY OF AUSTIN TO PURCHASE THE SYSTEM.
I KIND OF THINK THAT RUNS COUNTER TO POLICY GOALS ABOUT DIVESTING IN FOSSIL FUELS.
SO, YOU KNOW, I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF OTHER THINGS THAT CAN BE DONE TO BRING TEXAS GAS, UH, POLICIES AND RATES MORE AND ALIGN WITH CITY OF AUSTIN STATED POLICY PRIORITIES AND, UH, KIND OF VALUES, SPECIFICALLY THE RM CS IN THE PAST SUPPORTED IMPLEMENTING A TIERED RATE STRUCTURE SO THAT THOSE, JUST LIKE IN AUSTIN ENERGY RATES IN AUSTIN WATER RATES, THOSE WHO USE THE MOST ENERGY DO PAY MORE PER UNIT.
UM, SO I WOULD SUGGEST MAYBE EVEN ADDING SOME SPECIFICITY THERE BECAUSE THE RMC HAS PASSED THAT RECOMMENDATION IN THE PAST.
I REALIZE IT WASN'T THESE INDIVIDUALS HERE TODAY.
UM, AND THE OTHER THING THAT, UM, HAS HAPPENED IN THE PAST IS, UH, A SETTING OF A GOAL OF AN ACTUAL REDUCTION IN NATURAL GAS USAGE FROM TEXAS GAS CUSTOMERS.
SO RIGHT NOW, THE WAY THE PROGRAMS ARE STRUCTURED, EVEN IF, UH, THE THING BEING INCENTIVIZED ACTUALLY IS GOING TO INCREASE THE USE OF NATURAL GAS BY, SAY, CAUSING THE, UH, THE INSTALLATION OF A NEW NATURAL GAS APPLIANCE, THAT STILL COUNTS AS AN ENERGY EFFICIENCY GAIN WITH THE CALCULATIONS THEY USE.
UM, BUT WE DID GET THEM, AT LEAST AT THE TIME, TO START ALSO TRACKING THE ACTUAL REDUCTION IN NATURAL GAS USED.
SO I WOULD SUGGEST, YOU KNOW, FOCUS ON SOME, UH, HIGH LEVEL POLICIES LIKE THAT AS WELL AS LOOKING AT SOME OF THE SPECIFIC PROGRAMS, UH, WITHIN THE CONSERVATION PROGRAMS THAT MAYBE DON'T ACTUALLY HAVE SO MUCH TO DO WITH REDUCING NATURAL GAS USES.
IT IS ACTUALLY MAYBE ENCOURAGING THE PROLIFERATION OF NATURAL GAS APPLIANCES WHERE THEY MAYBE OTHERWISE WOULD NOT OCCUR.
SO, UM, YEAH, JUST WANTED TO, UH, SHARE THOSE AND JUST GENERALLY SAY THAT, YOU KNOW, THINK THIS IS A, UH, SOURCE OF GREENHOUSE GAS EMISSIONS FOR THE, UH, CITY OF AUSTIN AS A WHOLE.
UM, THE, THE, YOU KNOW, CITYWIDE AND I THINK ALIGNS WITH THE GOALS OF THE AUSTIN CLIMATE EQUITY PLAN TO REALLY TRY TO TAKE, UH, A LITTLE BIT MORE OWNERSHIP AS A CITY, THE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT, UH, THE HAVING A FRANCHISE THAT IS A CITY RESOURCE, AND WE SHOULD MAKE SURE THAT ALL CITY RESOURCES ARE DOING THE MOST THAT THEY CAN TO, I THINK, ALIGN WITH OUR POLICY PRIORITIES.
AND THIS IS, YOU KNOW, AN OPPORTUNITY THAT HAS NOT COME ALONG FREQUENTLY.
YOU KNOW, 20 YEARS IS A LONG TIME.
I DO THINK SHORTENING THAT UP, UM, WOULD BE GOOD JUST TO TRY TO KEEP, UM, I THINK ACCOUNTABILITY MORE AT THE FOREFRONT OF CONVERSATIONS 20 YEARS.
THAT'S REALLY KIND OF HARD TO, UM, I THINK HOLD PEOPLE TO, TO AGREEMENTS OVER THAT SORT OF TIMEFRAME.
UM, YOU MENTIONED THAT THE RMC HAS IN THE PAST, PAST RECOMMENDATION AROUND, UH, TIERS OF GAS, UH, GAS RATES.
CAN YOU TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THAT? YEAH, AND I'M SORRY I DON'T HAVE THE DATES, BUT IT'S OKAY.
UM, THE RECOMMENDATION, AS I RECALL, DID NOT SPECIFY EXACTLY WHERE THOSE BREAK POINTS SHOULD BE OR THE RATES ASSIGNED TO THEM, BUT WAS MORE OF A GENERAL RECOMMENDATION THAT,
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UH, THAT THE RATES SHOULD BE CHANGED TO BE A TIERED STRUCTURE THAT ALIGNS WITH, YOU KNOW, THE KIND OF, THE MORE YOU USE, THE MORE YOU PAY PER VOLUME.SO MORE PROGRESSIVE STRUCTURE.
AND I, I CAN'T REMEMBER FOR SURE, BUT THAT IF YOU FIND IT, THAT RESOLUTION MAY HAVE ALSO SPOKEN A LITTLE BIT TO THE RESIDENTIAL COMMERCIAL KIND OF RATE DIFFERENCES TOO.
BUT I KNOW FOR SURE IT RECOMMENDED TIERED RATES FOR RESIDENTIAL.
THAT'S ALL THE SPEAKERS WE HAVE.
UM, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR THE SPEAKERS WHO SIGNED UP AND SPENT, UH, TIME COMING TO TALK WITH US TONIGHT.
IT'S INVALUABLE TO HEAR FROM MEMBERS OF THE PUBLIC ON THESE IMPORTANT ISSUES.
[1. Approve the minutes of the Resource Management Commission Meeting on November 18, 2025.]
TURN TO OUR FIRST ITEM ON THE AGENDA, WHICH IS APPROVAL OF THE MINUTES.THEY SHOULD BE IN YOUR PACKET.
WE HAVE A MOTION TO APPROVE THE MINUTES.
IS THERE A SECOND? UH, COMMISSIONER KENARD SECOND COMM.
UH, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN MADE THE MOTION.
UH, ALL IN FAVOR OF ADOPTING THE MINUTES FROM THE NOVEMBER MEETING.
PLEASE RAISE YOUR HANDS SO I CAN SEE.
1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9, 10.
[2. Discussion and recommend a policy for the Texas Gas Service franchise negotiations.]
ON TO ITEM NUMBER TWO IN THE AGENDA.THAT IS DISCUSSION AND RECOMMENDED POLICY FOR THE TEXAS GAS SERVICE FRANCHISE NEGOTIATIONS.
UM, BEFORE WE GET STARTED ON THIS ITEM, I'M GONNA DO SOME HOUSEKEEPING.
UM, BECAUSE THIS IS JUST ONE ITEM ON OUR AGENDA, WE ARE ABLE TO TAKE ACTION ON ONE CONSOLIDATED RECOMMENDATION.
UM, I ASKED VICE CHAIR ROBBINS, UH, TO KINDLY SEPARATE, UH, THE, UH, RECOMMENDATION INTO INDIVIDUAL, UH, SECTIONS, WHICH HE, UM, WHICH HE GRACIOUSLY DID.
UH, I THOUGHT IT WOULD BE EASIER TO DIGEST AS PRE-READ MATERIAL.
HOPEFULLY YOU'VE ALL HAD A CHANCE TO, UH, GO THROUGH THOSE MATERIALS.
UM, BUT WE HAVE THE ORIGINAL RECOMMENDATION THAT, UH, WAS DISCUSSED BACK IN OCTOBER AND NOVEMBER.
AND IN THE, IN THE, UM, PACKETS, THERE ARE SEVEN BACKUP DOCUMENTS.
AND I'M GONNA SHARE MY SCREEN.
SO THIS IS THE RECONSTITUTED RECOMMENDATION WITH ALL OF THE PROPOSED AMENDMENTS INCLUDED.
UM, THE, THERE'S HIGHLIGHTED TEXTS.
THERE'S HIGHLIGHTED TEXTS, WHICH REPRESENTS, UH, CONTENT THAT'S BEING ADDED OR PROPOSED TO BE ADDED.
AND THERE'S STRIKE THROUGH TEXTS THAT'S PROPOSED TO BE REMOVED.
AND THE WAY THAT THIS IS GOING TO WORK IS, UH, WE'RE GONNA TREAT EACH SECTION AS AN INDIVIDUAL AMENDMENT.
UH, I WILL HEAR A MOTION AND A SECOND TO ADOPT THE AMENDMENT, AND THEN WE'LL OPEN THE FLOOR TO DISCUSSION.
UH, AND WE'RE GONNA TIME BOX THAT DISCUSSION TO KEEP US ON TRACK.
WE'RE GOING TO DO 10 MINUTES PER SECTION.
IF AFTER 10 MINUTES, COMMISSIONERS WOULD LIKE TO CONTINUE THE DISCUSSION, THEY MAY MAKE A MOTION TO CONTINUE.
AND IF THERE IS A SECOND, WE WILL CONTINUE THAT DISCUSSION.
OTHERWISE, WE'LL CALL THE QUESTION AND TAKE A VOTE.
UM, LET'S SEE IF AN AMENDMENT FAILS, THAT ENTIRE SECTION COMES OUTTA THE RECOMMENDATION.
AFTER WE'VE DISCUSSED AND VOTED ON ALL OF THE RECOMMENDATIONS, WE WILL VOTE ON, UH, THE ENTIRE RECOMMENDATION, THE CONSOLIDATE CONSOLIDATED RECOMMENDATION AS IT STANDS AFTER ALL THE DISCUSSION AND INCORPORATED AMENDMENTS.
ARE THERE ANY QUESTIONS? OKAY.
AND AS A FRIENDLY REMINDER, DISAGREEMENT IS NORMAL AND HEALTHY.
AND IN THIS ROOM, WE TREAT EACH OTHER WITH DIGNITY AND RESPECT.
DO I HAVE A MOTION TO ADOPT THE SECTION ONE TO AMENDMENTS? YES.
VICE CHAIR ROBBINS, MAY I, UH, JUST OFFER, UH, AN EXPLANATION TO THE PEOPLE THAT WERE NOT PART OF OUR SUB QUORUM? UH, IT'LL BE VERY QUICK.
UH, DUE TO OPEN MEETINGS LAWS, UH, NO MORE THAN FIVE OF US CAN TALK TO EACH OTHER BEFORE A VOTE ABOUT AN ISSUE.
THE PEOPLE READ INTO THIS, IF YOU WILL, WERE CHAIR DAVIS, MYSELF, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, STING, COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ,
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AND COMMISSIONER SIGON.UM, AND WE TRIED VERY HARD TO COME TO COMPROMISES WITHIN OUR GROUP, UH, SO THAT WE COULD EXPEDITE, UH, THIS TO THE ENTIRE GROUP.
IT DOESN'T MEAN THAT YOU CAN'T, UH, THAT THE MEMBERS WHO WEREN'T PART OF OUR GROUP CAN'T SPEAK OR, UH, GIVE YOUR OPINION.
BUT WE HAVE TRIED TO, UH, CHOREOGRAPH THIS, UH, TO BE CONSIDERATE OF YOUR TIME.
MOST OF WHAT'S IN HERE IS A CONSENSUS.
UH, SO I HEAR A MOTION TO ADOPT THE AMENDMENT FOR SECTION 1.0 SLASH 2.0.
CAN I, UM, JUST REAL QUICK, I THINK YOU NEED A MOTION FOR THE WHOLE THING FIRST.
AND THEN PEOPLE CAN START AMENDING IT.
MAY I HAVE A MOTION TO ADOPT THE RECOMMENDATION? I SO MOVE.
IS THERE A SECOND? THIS, THIS IS JUST FOR PURPOSES OF DISCUSSION TO GET IT ON THE TABLE.
NOW, WE WILL NOT VOTE RIGHT NOW.
THAT JUST OPENS THE FLOOR FOR DISCUSSION.
UM, I WOULD LIKE TO HEAR A MOTION TO OPEN DISCUSSION FOR THE FIRST SECTION AT THIS TIME.
I AM HAPPY TO SO MOVE, BUT I WANT TO CLARIFY A COUPLE THINGS IF I COULD PROCEDURALLY AND FOR THE, THE HELP OF EVERYBODY.
ONE OF THEM IS THAT THE DOCUMENT THAT IS ON THE SCREEN IS A DOCUMENT THAT CHAIR DAVIS HAD SENT THROUGH MS. GOODWIN TO EVERYBODY ON THIS COMMISSION THIS AFTERNOON.
SO YOU DO HAVE THAT PIECE OF PAPER CORRECT IN FRONT OF YOU.
AND THE OTHER THING I WANTED TO ASK IS, UM, WHEN YOU SAY WE'RE GONNA TALK ABOUT, FOR INSTANCE, SECTION 1.0 AND 2.0, THAT MEANS THAT YOU WANT TO TAKE UP BOTH THE, UM, THE WHEREAS HUNK AND THE BE IT RESOLVED, CORRECT.
AND I THINK A BETTER WAY TO, YES.
AND THE, AND A BETTER WAY TO PHRASE IT MAY BE, UM, THE SELECTION OF COMPANY AND TERM OF FRANCHISE PIECE.
SO THAT'S THE SECTION THAT WE WILL TALK ABOUT FIRST.
SO MOVE, LET'S TALK ABOUT THE, OKAY.
PART ONE, THE SELECTION OF COMPANY AND TERM OF FRANCHISE.
UM, I'M GONNA TURN IT OVER TO, UH, EITHER VICE CHAIR ROBBINS OR COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN TO TALK ABOUT THIS.
BUT WHAT I'LL SAY JUST TO BEGIN WITH IS THE WHERE SECTIONS OR THE, WHEREAS CLAUSES OF THIS SECTION HAVE NOT CHANGED SINCE WE LAST DISCUSSED IT, UH, IN NOVEMBER.
I'M GOING TO JUMP ON MY SCREEN TO THE 2.0 SECTION FOR SELECTION OF COMPANY AND TERM OF FRANCHISE.
UM, AND THESE ARE THE, THE RECOMMENDATIONS.
AND YOU'LL SEE THAT THE FIRST CLAUSE ABOUT, UM, CONDUCTING A COMPETITIVE BIDDING PROCESS HAS BEEN PROPOSED TO BE STRICKEN.
AND THEN TWO SECTIONS, UH, TWO RECOMMENDATIONS ARE ADDED.
UM, WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK TO THOSE TWO, VICE CHAIR ROBBINS? UH, FIRST, UM, ON, ON THE FIRST, UH, BULLET WHERE IT SAYS THE NEW FRANCHISE, THERE'S SOME EXTRANEOUS CHARACTER BEFORE IT STARTS.
UH, IT'S JUST A TYPOGRAPHICAL ERROR.
SO I'M, UH, IT'S JUST A CAPITALIZATION CORRECTION.
SO THAT, THERE'S NOTHING WRONG WITH THAT.
ON THE TWO PROPOSED NEW BULLETS, UH, NEW, UM, THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED, UH, OVER THE PRO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT, UM, A A 10 YEAR STRATEGY AND THEN A CONSIDERING DURING THESE 10 YEARS, CONSIDERING OTHER STRATEGIES, UH, INCLUDING COMPETITIVE BIDDING BY OTHER GAS UTILITIES AND MUNICIPALIZATION.
UM, AND THEN THIRD, UH, THE AGREEMENT SHOULD
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MAINTAIN THE CITY'S OPTION, UH, TO PURCHASE THE DISTRIBUTION SYSTEM THROUGHOUT THE ENTIRETY OF THE FRANCHISE TERM.UM, ALL, UH, I'M HEAVILY SUPPORTIVE OF THESE, BUT, UM, I DID NOT ORIGINATE THEM.
THESE WERE COMPROMISES WITH, UH, OTHER MEMBERS OF THE SUB QUORUM COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, I, I FULLY SUPPORT LIMITING THE NEW FRANCHISE AGREEMENT TO A TENURE YOUR TERM WITH THE FIRM EXPIRATION DATE.
I, UM, AGREE THAT WE SHOULD BE CONSIDERING ALTERNATE STRATEGIES TO LOWER RATES, UM, INCLUDING COMPETITIVE BIDDING WITH RESPECT TO MUNICIPALIZATION, UM, THAT I CAN, I THINK IT'S A TERRIBLE IDEA, BUT I CONSOLE MYSELF WITH, SO I SHARE THAT WITH, WITH OUR SPEAKER, UM, EX COMMISSIONER WHITE.
BUT, UM, AND OTHERS, HOWEVER, I CONSOLE MYSELF WITH THE THOUGHT THAT, UM, THE CITY'S CONSIDERATION OF THIS STRATEGY IS VERY LIKELY TO AGREE THAT IT'S A TERRIBLE IDEA AND WE DON'T WANNA IMPOSE MORE COSTS.
SO THEREFORE, I DON'T OBJECT TO LEAVING IN SHALL CONSIDER.
AND SINCE WE ALREADY HAVE THE OPTION TO PURCHASE THE DISTRIBUTION SYSTEM AND HAVE NOT YET EXERCISED IT BECAUSE WE HAVE BETTER THINGS TO DO WITH OUR MONEY, I'M OKAY WITH LEAVING THAT IN AS WELL.
SO NOTED QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS ON THIS ITEM? YES.
THIS IS A REALLY MUNDANE OBSERVATION, BUT I THINK THERE'S A, THE MISSING, UH, IN THE SECOND BULLET POINT JUST SAYS PURCHASE DISTRIBUTION SYSTEM AS OPPOSED TO PURCHASE THE DISTRIBUTION SYSTEM.
IS THIS THE MOMENT IN WHICH WE POINT THINGS OUT LIKE THAT? YES.
UM, SO ARE YOU PROPOSING TO ADD THE, OKAY.
UH, COMMISSIONER GARY, UM, THANK YOU.
CAN WE, UM, ADD, SO WHAT I'M THINKING ABOUT IS POSSIBLY HAVING, WHERE THERE'S A BIANNUAL REVIEW, UM, PROPOSED TO, FOR THE CHANGES IN ADDITIONS TO BE MONITORED THAT WE PROPOSE HERE.
IS THAT, I DON'T KNOW IF WE CAN PUT THAT HERE, BUT THAT'S THE ONLY COMMENT I HAVE.
LIKE, I THINK THERE SHOULD BE SOME TYPE OF REPORTING TO US TO MAKE SURE THAT THE THINGS THAT WE'RE PUTTING FORTH IS BEING ADHERED TO.
UH, UH, WHEN YOU SAY BIANNUAL REVIEW, UH, FIRST DO YOU MEAN EVERY OTHER YEAR AND SECOND, UH, C WHO IS DOING THE REVIEW? I'M TRYING.
I'M SO, SO BASICALLY WITH THE, WITH THE, THE COMPANY, WE WOULD GET THE REPORT SO WE CAN REVIEW TO MAKE SURE, WELL, WE'RE PUTTING FORTH IN THIS RESOLUTION THAT'S BEING ADHERED TO.
THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING AS FAR AS THE CONTRACT IS A CONCERNED, SO THE GAS COMPANY WOULD GIVE US A REPORT EVERY TWO YEARS.
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT, IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO PUT THAT THERE, BUT THAT WAS JUST A SUGGESTION.
UM, IF YOU WOULD LIKE TO PROPOSE LANGUAGE TO BE INCLUDED IN, IN THIS AS AN AMENDMENT, I'M HAPPY TO CAPTURE THAT.
UH, LEMME SEE WHERE WE CAN PUT THAT.
SO MAYBE JUST PUT, UH, THAT A BIANNUAL REVIEW OF THE PRO OF THE PROPOSED CHANGES AND ADDITIONS TO MONITOR CON CONTRACTUAL COMPLIANCE BE PROVIDED OR BE SUBMITTED, HOWEVER YOU WANNA PUT THAT BY THE COMPANY TO THE RMC.
UM, SO YOU'RE SAYING TEXAS GAS SERVICE'S SHOULD OKAY.
SUBMIT A BIANNUAL REVIEW OF THE PROPOSED CHANGES IN ADDITIONS, PROPOSED CHANGES IN ADDITIONS TO WHAT? SO BASICALLY, SO, OKAY.
MAYBE I'M NOT HELPING UNDERSTAND THIS.
SO THE CHANGES THAT WE'RE MAKING THAT WE'RE PUTTING FORTH, THAT WE'RE ASKING THEM TO CONSIDER, WE WANT OVERSIGHT.
I WOULD SAY, I, I DON'T WANNA CALL IT OVERSIGHT, BUT WE AT LEAST WANNA KNOW THAT WHAT WE PUT FORTH IS BEING ADHERED TO.
SO, I, I THINK I UNDERSTAND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS THAT THE CITY SHOULD HAVE IN PLACE SOME MECHANISM OF OVERSIGHT, UM, THAT THEY GET FROM THE GAS COMPANY DURING THE TERM, CORRECT.
OF CONTINUOUSLY OR PR PERIODICALLY THROUGHOUT THE TERM OF THE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT.
[00:30:01]
YES.UH, DOES SOMEONE WANNA, I WANNA CAPTURE THIS LANGUAGE.
DO YOU HAVE A SUGGESTION ON HOW TO, COMMISSIONER, WOULD IT BE APPROPRIATE TO USE THE WORD REPORT RATHER THAN REVIEW? THAT'S FINE.
UM, INSTEAD OF IN CHANGES IN ADDITIONS, I'M, I THINK THE SPIRIT IS OF, UH, ACTUALLY, HOW ABOUT JUST THAT? THE TEXAS GAS SERVICE SHOULD SUBMIT A BIANNUAL REPORT TO THE CITY TO MONITOR CONTRACTUAL COMPLIANCE.
ARE WE AT, WAS THAT A, DID I HEAR A DING ABOUT TIME? I STILL HAVE TWO MINUTES.
UH, OTHER, I'D LIKE TO HEAR FROM ANYONE ELSE THAT HAS QUESTIONS AND THEN WE'LL GET TO YOU.
DOES ANYONE ELSE HAVE COMMENTS ON THIS ONE? VICE CHAIR ROBBINS, PLEASE.
UM, TWO THINGS ABOUT THE PROPOSED AMENDMENT.
ONE, I DON'T IF THIS IS GOING TO BE IN THE DOCUMENT, IS THE SECTION 2.0 THE BEST PLACE? UH, SECOND, UM, I TRYING TO BE RESPECTFUL ABOUT THIS, BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT, UM, HAVING TEXAS GAS SERVICE DO AN OBJECTIVE REPORT ON TEXAS GAS SERVICE IS GONNA WORK.
IF THERE'S GONNA BE MONITORING OF THE AGREEMENT, THIS OUGHT TO BE DONE BY, UH, THE CITY AND NOT BY THE COMPANY.
YEAH, BUT YOU HAVE TO START SOMEWHERE AND, AND WE NEED TO GET INFORMATION FROM THE COMPANY ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.
AND A REPORT IS AS GOOD A WAY TO DO IT.
AS ANY WE CAN, WE CAN PURSUE ADDITIONAL INFORMATION AND, UM, BUT, BUT WE HAVE TO START SOMEWHERE.
AND GETTING IT A BIANNUAL REPORT IS, I THINK, A GOOD START.
AND THIS COMMISSION, THANKS TO YOU AND YOUR PERSISTENCE, VICE CHAIR ROBBINS HAS, HAS SIGNIFICANT OVERSIGHT RESPONSIBILITY FOR TEXAS GAS SERVICE, AND WE HAVE THE ABILITY TO ASK FOR ADDITIONAL INFORMATION IF WE WANT IT TO SUPPLEMENT THE REPORT.
YEAH, I WAS JUST GONNA POINT OUT, SO RIGHT NOW, IN TERMS OF REPORTS THAT WE'RE ASKING FOR IN THIS DOCUMENT, THERE'S THE, THE ONE AT SECTION, UH, 2.1 ABOUT THE PLANT COST.
I THINK IT SAYS, I KINDA LOST IT AGAIN.
ANNUAL REPORT BY TEXAS GAS SERVICE OF ITS EXPECTED PLANT COST.
SO WHAT WE'RE ASKING FOR HERE IS PROBABLY A MORE GENERAL REPORT ABOUT TEXAS GAS CONTRACTUAL COMPLIANCE WITH THE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT.
I GUESS TO THAT WE SHOULD JUST MAKE IT CLEAR THAT THIS ISN'T SUPERSEDING THAT ANNUAL REPORT THAT'S GOING ON THERE.
I THINK THERE'S ANOTHER REPORT SOMEWHERE.
UM, JUST LEAK DETECTION REPORT.
SO IS, IS YOUR COMMENT THAT YOU THINK THAT IT'S, IT'S AN EXCESSIVE AMOUNT OF REPORTING TO BE ASKING FOR? NO, THAT'S NOT MY COMMENT.
JUST THAT WE SHOULD MAKE IT CLEAR THAT, THAT THIS DOESN'T CONFLICT WITH THOSE TWO OTHER REPORTS THAT WE'RE ASKING FOR IN HERE.
DO YOU HAVE A SUGGESTED CHANGE TO THAT LANGUAGE? COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ? NO, I'LL TAKE THAT AS A NO.
UH, THEY REALLY DIDN'T PROVIDE US WITH COMPLETE INFORMATION.
I'M NOT SANGUINE ABOUT THEM PROVIDING COMPLETE INFORMATION FOR THIS PROPOSED BIANNUAL REPORT.
I WILL SUPPORT THIS IDEA IF THIS, UH, BIANNUAL MONITORING COMES FROM AN OBJECTIVE SOURCE LIKE THE CITY OF AUSTIN.
IT'S BEEN 10 MINUTES ON THIS ITEM.
DOES ANYONE, UH, IT'S BEEN 10 MINUTES.
[00:35:01]
DOES ANYONE WANNA CONTINUE DISCUSSION ON THIS? I VICE CHAIR MOVES TO CONTINUE DISCUSSION.UH, I, I WANTED TO, UH, MAKE A SUBSTITUTE MOTION.
IS THERE A SECOND TO CONTINUE DISCUSSION ON THIS ITEM? I SECOND COMMISSIONER HERE.
UH, I, I WILL SUPPORT THIS MOTION IF THE, THE CITY OF AUSTIN MAKES THE BIANNUAL REPORT.
UH, AND IF YOU WOULD JUST INSERT THAT, UH, IF WE CAN VOTE ON THAT, UH, AS A SUBSTITUTE MOTION, THEN, THEN THAT'S MY PROPOSAL.
UH, SO YOU'RE SAYING THE CITY OF AUSTIN SHOULD, UH, SHOULD CONDUCT A BIANNUAL REPORT? YES.
AND COMMISSIONER GARY, YOUR COMMENT ABOUT THAT? NO, I, I WOULD PREFER THAT IT COMES FROM TEXAS GAS.
UM, I THINK IF YOU HAVE TOO MANY HANDS ON IT, UM, I THINK IT'S COMING STRAIGHT FROM THE SOURCE, WE'LL BE ABLE TO MAKE OUR COMMENTS, UM, REVIEW IT AND GIVE, AND HAVE THAT, YOU KNOW, COLLABORATION WITH THEM AND CONVERSATION SO WE CAN MAKE SURE THAT WE GET WHAT WE NEED.
I THINK SENDING IT THROUGH THE CITY, THEN SENDING IT TO US IS JUST TOO, TOO COMPLEX.
UH, WE WANNA KEEP IT SIMPLE AND MAKE SURE THAT WE GET EVERYTHING WE NEED.
SO I FEEL THAT IT SHOULD COME FROM THE SOURCE.
IS THERE A YES, VICE CHAIR? UM, WOULD IT BE APPROPRIATE TO ASK IF THERE'S A SECOND FOR, UH, MY SUBSTITUTE? UH, YOU, YOU MAY, YES.
WHAT IS YOUR SUBSTITUTE? WE'RE CONTINUING DISCUSSION ON THIS ITEM AGAIN.
I JUST THINK THAT AN OBJECTIVE THIRD PARTY, LIKE THE CITY OF AUSTIN, SHOULD BE THE ONE TO SUBMIT THIS.
AND AGAIN, UH, IF ANYONE HERE HAS LISTENED TO PAST PRESENTATIONS ON THEIR ENERGY CONSERVATION PROGRAMS THAT THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO, THAT TEXAS GAS SERVICE IS REQUIRED TO REPORT, THEY HAVE BEEN WOEFULLY INADEQUATE.
AND SO, I I CAN'T EXPECT THAT, UH, A BIANNUAL REPORT BY THEM IS GONNA BE COMPLETE.
UM, I THINK IT STARTED TO GET REPETITIVE, SO I'M GOING TO, UM, MOVE US ALONG FROM THAT.
UH, I DON'T THINK THAT THERE'S ANY HARM IN ASKING FOR THIS IN THE RECOMMENDATION.
UM, AND ALSO AT ANY TIME, WE ARE EMPOWERED TO ASK THE CITY TO, UH, REPORT TO US ON COMPLIANCE WITH THE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT FOR THE GAS UTILITY.
UH, WE HAVE SIX OTHER SECTIONS TO GET THROUGH, SO I WOULD PROPOSE WE CALL THE QUESTION AND MOVE ON.
I DO WANNA RECOGNIZE COMMISSIONER FARMER, THOUGH.
I'M, I'M GOOD WITH WHAT YOU JUST SAID.
UM, NO, I, I JUST, I'M GOOD WITH WHAT YOU SAID, SO YEAH, WE CAN MOVE ON.
ANY WITHOUT OBJECTION, I'M GONNA CALL THE QUESTION ON THIS AMENDMENT, UH, SELECTION OF COMPANY AND TERM OF FRANCHISE.
UH, ALL IN FAVOR OF THIS AMENDMENT AS IT APPEARS HERE.
I'M SEEING 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9 IN FAVOR.
ALL OPPOSED, PLEASE RAISE YOUR HAND.
ONE OPPOSED? THAT'S VICE CHAIR.
UH, THE AMENDMENT CARRIES NINE TO ONE.
MOVING ON THE NEXT SECTION, I WILL HEAR A MOTION FOR SECTION ON HIGH AND INEQUITABLE RATES.
WE'RE GONNA OPEN DISCUSSION ON, UH, SECTION 1.1, HIGH AND INEQUITABLE RATES.
UH, AS YOU WILL SEE, THERE'S BEEN SOME, UH, A LITTLE BIT OF CHANGE IN, IN THE WORDING OF THE, WHEREAS CLAUSES TO CHANGE THE YEARS AND THE PERCENTAGES OF THE GAS RATES, UM, ABOVE INFLATION.
AND THEN IN ADDITION, THE ADDITION OF, UH, ONE CLAUSE WHICH READS, WHEREAS WHEN AUSTIN ENERGY AND AUSTIN WATER IMPLEMENTED FULL CAPITAL RECOVERY FEES, THEY EXPERIENCED RATE DECREASES.
AND ALSO WE HAVE COMBINED THIS SECTION USED TO BE TWO SECTIONS.
HIGH AND INEQUITABLE RATES AND RATE STRUCTURE HAVE BEEN COMBINED INTO ONE SECTION.
[00:40:02]
WHO WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK ON, ON THIS VERY QUICKLY? GO AHEAD.UM, THIS IS ONE OF THE MO MOST IMPORTANT OF ALL THE RECOMMENDATIONS.
AND JUST TO GIVE THE COMMISSIONERS WHO ARE NOT READ INTO THIS A SENSE OF WHAT WE WERE TRYING TO DO.
UH, IN THE 20 23, 20 24 RATE CASE, UH, THERE WAS A HUGE RATE INCREASE BECAUSE THERE HAD BEEN A 64% INCREASE, EXCUSE ME, A 62% INCREASE IN THE PLANT COST IN JUST A THREE OR FOUR YEAR PERIOD.
UH, WHICH TO ME WAS JUST CRAZY.
AND ORIGINALLY, UH, I HAD IN, IN NOVEMBER, I HAD A PROPOSED PRE-APPROVAL AND THERE WAS PUSHBACK FROM SEVERAL OF THE COMMISSIONERS, IS THIS LEGAL? IS THIS WISE? AND SO I CAME UP WITH A DIFFERENT STRATEGY.
UH, INSTEAD, THIS WOULD BASICALLY ALLOW US TO HIRE A CONSULTANT, UH, FOR A RELATIVELY MANAGEABLE MANAGEABLY, SMALL AMOUNT OF MONEY PER RATE PAYER.
AND THEY WOULD REVIEW THE CIP, THE CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT PROGRAM IN ADVANCE, UH, AND THEY WOULD GET IT ON RECORD IF THERE WAS, IF, IF THIS WAS NOT USED AND USEFUL, IF THIS DIDN'T NEED TO BE DONE.
NOW, IF THIS WAS GOLD PLATING, UH, AND IT COULD BE USED IN A RATE CASE, IT COULD BE USED IN A COURT CASE, APPEALING THE RATE CASE, IT COULD BE ON RECORD YEARS BEFORE, UH, ANY RATE CASE CAME UP.
UH, AND, UH, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, UH, BASICALLY, UH, SAID, SHE, SHE ASKED, WELL, IS THIS, WILL IT WORK? AND I SAID, IT'S NEVER BEEN TRIED.
WE DON'T KNOW, BUT I THINK IT WILL WORK.
I THINK IT'S THE BEST WAY FORWARD.
COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN ALSO, UH, SAID THAT WE OUGHT TO LOOK NOT ONLY AT WHETHER THE UH, PROJECT WAS NEEDED, WHETHER IT WAS GOLD PLATING, BUT ONCE A PROJECT IS STARTED, WHAT HAPPENS WITH THE EXPENDITURES? UH, ARE THERE OVERRUNS? ARE THOSE OVERRUNS JUSTIFIED? AND SO I'VE TRIED TO, UH, FOLLOW HER CAUTION ABOUT THIS IN INSERTED LANGUAGE, UH, WHICH IS HIGHLIGHTED IN BLUE.
UH, AND I'M HOPING THAT WILL, UM, SATISFY, UM, THOSE CONCERNS.
UM, THAT'S, I'VE BEEN DOING THIS FOR DECADES.
THIS THE BEST THING, THAT IDEA THAT I COULD COME UP WITH.
I THINK MOST OF US, UH, AND I'M, THIS IS INTUITION.
I THINK MOST OF US ARE ON BOARD WITH FULL CAPITAL RECOVERY FEES OR FULL CAC.
THANK YOU, UH, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN.
AND, AND MY THANKS TO, UM, VICE CHAIR ROBBINS FOR HIS, UM, OPEN EARS AND PATIENCE.
THIS HAS BEEN A LONG AND ARDUOUS PROCESS.
I HAVE THREE CONCERNS ABOUT THIS SET, ALTHOUGH I COMPLETELY SUPPORT THE CONCERN AND SHARE THE CONCERN FOR THE MAGNITUDE OF THESE COST INCREASES AND THE CAUSES FOR THEM.
UM, I, MY FIRST, A COUPLE OF THESE, AND I APOLOGIZE FOR BEING A REGULATORY PINHEAD ABOUT THIS, BUT IT'S, I'M ON THIS COMMISSION, I ASSUME IN PART BECAUSE OF MY REGULATORY EXPERIENCE.
SO THE FIRST ONE IS THAT WITH RESPECT TO CAPITAL RECOVERY FEES, UM, I TOTALLY WANT THIS TO HAPPEN.
I WILL POINT OUT THAT IN MOST CASES, THE UTILITY, AT LEAST ON THE ELECTRIC SIDE AND POSSIBLY ON WATER, THERE IS A STANDARD ALLOWANCE FOR, YOU KNOW, YOU GET THIS MANY PIECE, FEET OF LINE EXTENSION THAT ALL OF US COVER.
AND IF YOU ARE BEYOND THAT MANY FEET,
[00:45:01]
IT'S ON YOU.AND SO WE MIGHT WANT TO CRAFT SOME MODIFICATION TO THIS LANGUAGE TO COVER THE IDEA THAT SHORT LINE EXTENSIONS ARE STANDARD OPERATING PROCESS THAT EVERYBODY COVERS.
BECAUSE THAT'S PART OF WHY WE ARE A COMMU IN A COMMUNITY UTILITY, IS WE ARE ALL BEARING THE COST AND SHARING THE COSTS.
BUT IF YOUR COST IN POSITION IS EXTRAORDINARY, THAT DOES NOT GET COLLECT COLLECTED FROM EVERYONE.
THE COMPLICATION HERE IS THAT, AND I WONDER IF OUR COLLEAGUE FROM THE, UM, GAS COMPANY, THERE YOU ARE, CAN CAN YOU ANSWER A COUPLE QUESTIONS, PLEASE? THANK YOU.
AND, AND START BY INTRODUCING YOURSELF FOR ALL OF OUR HUGE HOME AUDIENCE.
GOOD EVENING, LARRY GRAHAM WITH TEXAS GAS SERVICE.
DID, AM I CORRECT IN THINKING THAT THE, IN THE RAILROAD COMMISSION CASE THAT WAS JUST CONCLUDED, THE RAILROAD COMMISSION EXPLICITLY DECLINED TO IMPOSE CAPITAL, UM, CAPITAL EXTENSION FEE RECOVERY? UH, SO A COUPLE, COUPLE THINGS.
SO THE RAILROAD COM, THE COMMISSION WILL MEET A WEEK FROM TODAY TO, UM, MAKE A DECISION.
AND, AND BY THE WAY, THE PROPOSAL FOR DECISION IN FRONT OF THEM DOES RECOMMEND CONSOLIDATION OF THE RATES.
AND BY THE WAY, THE RATES FOR AUSTIN CUSTOMERS WILL ACTUALLY DECREASE A SMALL AMOUNT, NOT A LOT, BUT THEY ARE GONNA DECREASE.
SO I BELIEVE, I WAS TALKING TO OUR DIRECTOR OF RATES TODAY.
WHAT THEY HAVE DONE IS FOR EACH, AS EACH UTILITY GOES THROUGH A RATE CASE IN THE FINAL ORDER AND THE, UM, THE RULES OF SERVICE, THEY'VE MADE IT CLEAR THAT IF A, UM, GAS UTILITY WERE TO ADVANCE MONEY TO A DEVELOPER, SO THE DEVELOPER CHOOSES THEM, THAT THOSE, THOSE FEES CANNOT BE RECOVERED.
NOW, LET ME BE CLEAR, THAT'S A PRACTICE THAT WE HAVE NEVER ENGAGED IN OTHER, THERE'S SOME REALLY SMALL UTILITIES THAT HAVE PICKED OFF, UM, YOU KNOW, NEW SUBDIVISIONS KIND OF IN THE EXCERPTS THAT HAVE DONE THAT.
AND THAT THAT'S WHAT THEY HAVE, HAVE DONE.
AND I, I, I WOULD SAY PAUL'S PROBABLY A LITTLE BIT WRONG.
THE MAJORITY, ESPECIALLY IN AUSTIN, OF WHAT WE, OUR CAPITAL BUDGET IS REMOVING, UM, OLD PIPE.
AND OF ALL THE VINTAGE PIPE WE HAVE IN THE STATE OF TEXAS, THERE'S A DISPROPORTIONATE AMOUNT OF IT HERE THAT WE, UM, SPEND A LARGE PERCENTAGE OF OUR CAPITAL BUDGET REMOVING EACH YEAR.
THERE'S KIND OF FEDERAL AND STATE REGULATIONS TO DO THAT.
I DON'T KNOW IF I ANSWERED YOUR QUESTION, BUT THAT'S WHAT I KNOW ABOUT THE RATE CASE.
SO THE OTHER THING IS THEY'VE ASKED US TO PUT, WE'VE ALWAYS HAD THIS, THE, FOR THE ECONOMIC FORMULA THAT WE USE, IF SOMEBODY COMES TO US AND SAYS, HEY, YOU KNOW, WE'RE BUILDING A SUBDIVISION WHERE YOU EXTEND TO MAINE, THAT IS IN OUR RULES OF SERVICE, HOW THE, THE ACTUAL MATH THAT WE USE TO DETERMINE, UM, IF WE WILL DO IT, AND HOW MUCH THEY, HOW, WHAT PERCENTAGE OF THAT THAT THEY PAY.
SO THAT'S BEEN A LITTLE BIT MORE FORMALIZED.
I THINK THEY'VE HAD TO APPROVE THE, UM, YOU KNOW, THE ACTUAL ECONOMIC MODEL AND IT'S NOW APPEARS IN OUR RULES OF SERVICE.
SO IF A DEVELOPER PAYS FOR A LINE EXTENSION, DOES THAT GO INTO YOUR RATE BASE OR DOES THAT REMAIN SEPARATE? OH, IT REMAINS SEPARATE.
SO CONTRIBUTIONS IN AID OF CONSTRUCTION.
AND SO IT, IT DOES HAPPEN, IT'S, WE DO NOT USE OUR MONEY OF THE CUSTOMER'S MONEY FOR ALL THE MAIN EXTENSIONS WE DO.
YOU KNOW, THERE'S A GOOD PERCENTAGE OF THESE PROJECTS THAT REQUIRE A CONTRIBUTION FROM THEM, YOU KNOW, DEPENDING ON WHERE THEY ARE.
AND LIKE YOU, AND YOU'RE RIGHT, IF WE'RE JUST EXTENDING THE MAIN A SHORT DISTANCE, THE ECONOMICS ARE USUALLY SUCH THAT WE WILL PAY FOR IT.
SECOND, UM, WITH RESPECT TO, TO, I THANK YOU.
UM, WITH RESPECT TO THE ACTUAL CAPITAL, UH, VICE CHAIR ROBBINS PROPOSAL ABOUT, I SUPPORT THE, THE, THE REQUEST, THE, THE REQUIRING AN ANNUAL REPORT OF EXPECTED PLANT COSTS FOR THE COMING YEAR.
THE PROBLEM IS, YES, IT IS INAPPROPRIATE TO CONDUCT A PRUDENCE ANALYSIS ON A BUDGET PLAN BECAUSE THERE ARE ALWAYS THINGS THAT COME UP, LIKE STUFF EXPLODES OR YOU DISCOVER A SECTION OF BAD PIPE, OR YOU GET A DEVELOPER REQUEST.
CAPITAL BUDGETS CHANGE A LOT AND ACTUAL PHYS ACTUAL EXPENDITURES IN A YEAR CHANGE A LOT.
[00:50:01]
AND IT IS, IT IS NOT ACCURATE OR APPROPRIATE TO CONDUCT A PRUDENCE ANALYSIS ON WHAT SOMEBODY PLANNED TO DO.REGULATORS ONLY DO PRUDENCE ANALYSIS ON WHAT DID YOU ACTUALLY DO, SPEND THE MONEY ON? DID YOU SPEND IT IN A WISE WAY? YOU CAN LOOK AT DID THE, UM, DID THE COST OF THE PROJECT MATCH WHAT YOU BUDGETED FOR? DID THE SET OF PROJECTS THAT YOU INVESTED IN MATCH YOUR PRIORITIES FOR INVESTMENT OR THE ACTUAL CONTINGENCIES THAT OCCURRED OVER THE YEAR? BUT YOU CANNOT CONDUCT A PRUDENCE ANALYSIS ON SOMEBODY'S PLANS.
IF THAT WERE THE CASE, I'D BE FLUNKING PRUDENCE EVERY DAY BECAUSE WHAT I PLAN TO DO AT THE START OF THE DAY NEVER MATCHES WHAT I ACTUALLY GET DONE.
AND THE SAME THING, WE, WE SHOULD HAVE THE SAME EXPECTATION AND WITH RESPECT TO WHAT OUR UTILITIES ARE ACTUALLY SPENDING CAPITAL ON, AND, AND, UM, YOU KNOW, NOBODY GOES OUT.
WELL, MAYBE PEOPLE DO GO OUT SAYING, I'M PLANNING TO GOLD PLATE THIS PUPPY, AND, AND, AND HERE'S HOW I'M GONNA BURY THE COSTS IN THE BUDGET.
IT IS A LOT EASIER TO DETERMINE THAT WHAT THE COSTS, WHAT COSTS WERE APPROPRIATE AFTER THEY'VE SPENT THE MONEY.
AND YOU CAN, YOU CAN COMBINE THAT WITH SOME AUDITING AND SOME OTHER STUFF.
BUT, SO SURE, LET'S DO, UH, A REPORT OF TELL US YOUR PROJECT CAPITAL PROJECT PLANS, BUT THEN WE ALSO, IF WE WANT TO DO SOME KIND OF CONSULTANT ANALYSIS OF PRUDENCE, IT MUST REFLECT AND BE BASED ON ACTUAL PROJECT EXPENDITURES AND CAPEX.
SO, F FROM WHAT I'M LABOR ALL NO, NO, NO, THAT, THAT'S HELPFUL.
SO JUST TO PARAPHRASE AND TELL ME IF I'VE GOT THIS RIGHT.
YOU, YOU ARE NOT, YOU DO NOT SUPPORT THIS AMENDMENT.
IF IT ASKS FOR, UH, PRE WELL REVIEW OF PROPOSED PLAN COSTS ONLY RETROSPECTIVE.
VICE CHAIR S THEY ALREADY DO RETROSPECTIVE ANALYSIS IN EVERY RATE CASE, BUT YOUR SPECIFIC GOAL IS NOT TO WAIT UNTIL A RATE CASE.
YOUR SPECIFIC GOAL IS THE CITY OF AUSTIN SHOULD BE LOOKING AT THE PRUDENCE HA DOING OUR VIEW AND ANALYSIS OF WHICH OF THESE EXPENDITURES ARE PRUDENT.
IF YOU WANT TO DO THAT, IT MUST BE ON ACTUAL INVESTMENTS, NOT ON PROPOSED.
IF IT IS A BRIDGE TO NOWHERE, THEN THAT CAN BE PREDETERMINED, UH, WITHOUT THE, THE, UH, INVOLVEMENT THAT YOU'RE, UM, YOU'RE SPEAKING OF.
AND, UH, TO GO BACK TO ONE OF THE OTHER POINTS THAT YOU MADE, UM, I COULD BE WRONG, UM, BUT I'M PRETTY SURE THAT AUSTIN ENERGY AND AUSTIN WATER HAVE VERY LITTLE OR NO, UH, UH, FREE, UH, UH, LINE EXTENSIONS AT ALL.
UH, I MEAN, IT'S BEEN VERY CLEAR FOR A LONG TIME THAT, UH, THEY ARE COLLECTING 100% OF THE COST OF A NEW DEVELOPMENT.
UM, UH, BUT TO, TO YOUR SECOND POINT, I DON'T KNOW WHY WE CAN'T DO BOTH.
I DON'T KNOW IF WE HAVE A CONSULTANT AND THEY, LET'S SAY THE FIRST YEAR, THEY CAN ONLY LOOK AT WHAT'S BEING PROPOSED.
AND IF THAT'S, UH, IF THEY THINK THIS IS THE BRIDGE TO NOWHERE, OR IF THEY THINK THIS IS THE LEGITIMATE, BUT GOING FORWARD, THEN YEAH, THEY, THEY CAN, THEY CAN SAY, WELL, THIS PROJECT HAS PROCEEDED FOR A YEAR AND IT'S, UH, COSTS ARE LEGITIMATE OR NOT, I AM CONCERNED.
UM, JUST SO ONE MOMENT, UH, WE'RE AT 14 MINUTES.
I'M GONNA NEED A, A MOTION AND A SECOND TO CONTINUE DEBATE ON THIS.
I COMMISSIONER SILVERSON, I AM CONCERNED THAT A, IT WILL BE A, A CONSULTANT, IT WILL BE DIFFICULT TO FIND SOMEONE WITH THE TALENTS AND SKILLS TO DO THIS CONSISTENTLY.
AND AS AN ONGOING PROCESS, IT'LL BE VERY DIFFICULT TO GET A, THIS, A CITY THAT IS ALREADY SIGNIFICANTLY CASH CONSTRAINED TO DO THIS ON AN ONGOING BASIS.
I DON'T THINK MONITORING, UM, ONGOING ANALYSES OF, OF TEXAS GAS SERVICE CAPEX IS SOMETHING THAT THE CITY COUNCIL WILL BE VERY EXCITED ABOUT SPENDING MONEY ON.
AND I AM FURTHER CONCERN, WE, WE DON'T HAVE ANY AUTHORITY TO TELL TEXAS GAS SERVICE, DON'T
[00:55:01]
SPEND THIS MONEY.YOUR PRIMARY MOTIVATION FOR THIS AT WHAT YOU TOLD ME WAS I, WE WANT TO BUILD A RECORD THAT WE CAN USE IN A FUTURE RATE CASE.
WE CANNOT DO THAT IF A CONSULTANT, IF WE'RE PAYING A CONSULTANT TO LOOK AT THIS AND TO, TO TWITCH ALL THE TIME ON PROPOSED PROJECTS, HALF THE TIME BY THEY FINISH THE ANALYSIS, THE MONEY'S ALREADY SPENT, WE CAN'T KEEP UP.
SO, SO I THINK THAT, THAT DOING ANYTHING OTHER THAN HERE IS THERE, I THINK THE BEST WAY TO SET THIS UP IS SEND ME A LIST OF WHAT YOU PRO PROPOSED TO SPEND YOUR CAPEX ON, AND THEN SEND ME A A AND ALL OF THE DETAILS ON WHAT YOU ACTUALLY SPENT THE MONEY ON AND RE AND, AND WE WILL DO, IF WE CAN GET A CONSULTANT TO, TO DO IT, WE WILL DO SOME KIND OF ANALYSIS ON THAT.
IT WILL NOT, IN ALL LIKELIHOOD, BE A UTILITY IN REGULATORY GRADE ANALYSIS.
AND ALSO, UM, SORRY, I JUST HAD A POST CHEMO MOMENT AND FORGOT WHERE I WAS GOING WITH THAT.
UM, ARE THERE OTHER COMMISSIONERS THAT WANT TO WEIGH IN ON THIS ISSUE? YES.
UM, MY PERSPECTIVE AS A NON-REGULATORY PERSON, UM, IS THE WORD PRUDENCE.
THE, THE, THE SORT OF SUBSTANTIVE ISSUE HERE THAT MAYBE THERE'S A COMPROMISE THAT IF WE MOVED AWAY FROM THAT WORD, THE, THE, UM, YOU ARE PROBABLY CLOSER TO A WORKING DEFINITION OF IT THAN, THAN THAN WHEN I STARTED DOING PRUDENCE CASES A THOUSAND YEARS AGO AS A REGULATOR, ONE ON THE ELECTRIC SIDE.
BUT IT INVOLVES QUESTIONS LIKE, IS THIS, UM, DID YOU SPEND, DO THE RIGHT PROJECT FOR THE RIGHT AMOUNT OF MONEY IN THE RIGHT WAY WITH THE RIGHT DESIGN? UM, AND AND DID WAS IS IT ALSO, IT'S ALSO INVOLVED IN USED AND USEFUL, WHICH IS WHY PAUL KEEPS TALKING ABOUT THE BRIDGE TO NOWHERE.
UM, OH, I KNOW WHAT THE, MAY I, MAY I ADD ON THIS? WAS THAT HELPFUL? YES, THAT WAS HELPFUL.
UM, MY OTHER, THE OTHER THOUGHT THAT I WANTED TO COMPLETE PREVIOUSLY IS BECAUSE OUR REGION, AUSTIN, HAS BEEN CONSOLIDATED WITH THE REST OF TEXAS GAS SERVICE TEXAS TERRITORIES.
THIS IS NOT JUST ABOUT WHAT CAPEX ARE BEING DONE IN AUSTIN.
WE ARE ESSENTIALLY PROPOSING WITH THIS TO STUDY THE ENTIRE CAPEX PROJECTS AND PROPOSALS AND ACTUAL EXPENDITURES ACROSS ALL OF TGS TEXAS SERVICE TERRITORY, WHICH IS WHY THIS, UM, HAS A BULLET IN IT THAT SAYS CO-FUND THE CONSULTANT WITH OTHER CITIES.
IF WE CAN GET THEM TO PARTICIPATE, BECAUSE WE ARE NOT GONNA BE PAYING FOR AUSTIN PROJECTS ALONE.
WE ARE GOING TO BE PAYING FOR EVERY PROJECT, EVERY CAPEX EXPENDITURE THAT IS GONNA GO INTO RATE BASE ACROSS TGS SERVICE AREA.
WE WILL BE PAYING A SHARE OF THAT.
AND SOMETIMES WE'LL COME OUT AHEAD AND SOMETIMES WE'LL COME OUT BEHIND.
SO IT SOUNDS LIKE THE, THE, THE DISAGREEMENT IS WITH THIS BULLET POINT, THE CITY SHOULD HIRE A CONSULTANT TO REVIEW THE PROPOSED PLANT COSTS FOR PRUDENT EXPENDITURES.
UM, THEIR, UH, I'M TRYING TO WEIGH WHETHER THE REST OF THESE RECOMMENDATIONS ARE GENERALLY ACCEPTABLE.
COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, I, I, WELL, THE, WITH RESPECT TO EVERYTHING EXCEPT THE, THE RATE STRUCTURE, WHICH IS A, I VIEW AS A RELATED BUT SEPARATE ISSUE THAT I HAVEN'T STARTED TALKING ABOUT YET.
SO, SO MY PROPOSED EDIT TO THE BOTTOM OF PAGE FIVE WOULD READ, UM, THE CITY SHOULD HIRE A CONSULTANT TO, TO REVIEW TGS ACTUAL CAPITAL INVESTMENT PROJECTS OR CAP AND IN CAPITAL IMPROVEMENT, SOME WORDING LIKE THAT.
I, I HAVE A POINT OF, UH, PROCEDURAL QUESTION FOR THE LIAISON.
UH, IS IT, I'M, UH, WE'RE TAKING THESE AMENDMENTS AS AN ENTIRE SECTION OF AN AMENDMENT.
IS IT POSSIBLE TO, TO VOTE ON PORTIONS OF THESE OR VOTE ON THE AMENDMENT AND THEN REOPEN? I'M TRYING TO SAY LIKE, 'CAUSE WE'RE, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT 5, 6, 7 BULLET POINTS.
UM, YOU COULD DO A SENSE OF THE COMMISSION, I BELIEVE.
I THINK YOU COULDN'T BECAUSE THEN YOU'RE LIKE AN AMENDED AMENDMENT.
[01:00:01]
NOT GONNA, WE'RE NOT GONNA GO THERE.AND WHEN IT GETS REPETITIVE, I'M GONNA, I'M GONNA CALL THE QUESTION, BUT YES, PLEASE RESPOND.
WELL, THIS WON'T BE REPETITIVE.
UM, IT'S A QUESTION WAS ASKED, UH, ABOUT A POINT WAS RAISED THAT A CITY THAT IS CASH CONSTRAINED WOULD NOT PAY FOR THIS.
AND THERE'S A BULLET RIGHT IN HERE THAT SAYS THAT THIS WOULD BE FUNDED EITHER WITH AN INCREASED FRANCHISE FEE OR A BILL RIDER.
SO THIS WILL NOT COME FROM THE CITY'S CASH CONSTRAINED GENERAL FUND.
UH, I'M VERY SENSITIVE TO THAT, UH, REGARDING, UM, UH, HOW MUCH THE, UH, UH, COMMITTEE CHAIR DAVIS ASKED ME, UH, HOW MUCH WILL THIS COST? OF COURSE, WE'VE NEVER DONE IT.
BUT I SAID, AS AN EXAMPLE, IF THE COST WAS A HUNDRED THOUSAND DOLLARS, IT WOULD RESULT IN A COST OF ABOUT 30 CENTS A YEAR TO THE AVERAGE RESIDENTIAL RATE PAYER.
WHAT A YEAR? I BELIEVE IT'S A YEAR.
UH, AND, UH, IT, IT COULD ACTUALLY BE 20 CENTS DEPENDING ON HOW YOU LOOKED AT IT.
SO, AND THEN YOU ALSO HAVE TO CONSIDER, AND IT IS TRUE, AUSTIN REPRESENTS ABOUT ONE THIRD OF THE ENTIRE, UH, STATE, UH, IN TERMS OF TEXAS GAS SERVICE CUSTOMERS, ABOUT 33%.
AND SO, UH, IT WOULD BEHOOVE US IF WE'RE GONNA REVIEW BRIDGES TO NOWHERE THROUGHOUT THE STATE, TO ENLIST PARTNERS, ENLIST GALVESTON, ENLIST EL PASO, UH, ASK THEM IF THEY WANT TO BE CO-FUNDERS.
I, UH, HAVE HEARD EL PASO'S RATES MAY GO UP 25 AS MUCH AS 25%.
IF THE RAILROAD COMMISSION PASSES THE RATE INCREASE NEXT WEEK, I THINK THEY WOULD BE VERY INTERESTED.
I THINK THEY'D BE INTERESTED IN ANYTHING THAT WOULD LOWER THEIR RATES.
UH, I DON'T DISAGREE WITH, UH, COMMISSIONER, UH, SILVERSTEIN ON WANTING TO LOOK AT, UH, THINGS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN SPENT.
I THINK MY CONCERN IS BOTH, I WOULD LIKE TO, UH, ENLIST, UH, THE COMMISSION SUPPORT FOR BOTH, UH, THINGS THAT ARE TO BE SPENT AND THINGS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN SPENT.
AND IF THOSE WERE SPENT PRUDENTLY, I HOPE THAT WASN'T TOO REPETITIVE.
UM, DO YOU HAVE, UH, SUGGESTED LANGUAGE TO INCORPORATE THAT? ME, UH, WELL, THE CITY SHOULD HIRE A CONSULTANT TO REVIEW THE PROPOSED AND, UH, ACTUAL PLANT COST.
I THOUGHT WHAT WAS IN HERE COVERED IT, BUT I'M OPEN TO CLARIFICATION FROM YOU CHAIR DAVIS.
IF, IF I MAY, I BELIEVE THAT BOTTOM BULLET ON PAGE FIVE COULD BE MODIFIED TO READ, UM, TO REVIEW THE PROPOSED AND, UM, PROPOSED PLANT COSTS AND ACTUAL CAPITAL EXPENDITURES FOR PRUDENCE, ANY, AND THEN WE, WE WOULD, UM, DO AN ANNUAL, THE MODIFIED, THE ANNUAL REPORT BULLET ABOVE TO, TO DELETE THE PHRASE PRIOR TO THEIR EXPENSE AND ADD SOMETHING LIKE, AND, UM, ACTUAL CAP THAT ALL EXPENDITURES AND PROJECTS FOR THE PRECEDING FISCAL YEAR.
WOULD YOU REPEAT THAT PLEASE? UM, SOUNDS GOOD.
IN THE, IN THE SECOND BULLET FROM THE BOTTOM AFTER THE PHRASE, FOR THE COMING YEAR, DELETE PRIOR TO THEIR EXPENSE, ADD IN THE LANGUAGE AND ACTUAL CAPITAL EXPENDITURES AND PROJECTS FOR THE COMPLETED FISCAL YEAR.
SO THAT WAY, THAT WAY WE WOULD BE GETTING BOTH.
[01:05:01]
HERE'S WHAT WE ACTUALLY SPENT IN A SINGLE REPORT.HERE'S WHAT WE ACTUALLY SPENT IN TERMS OF DOLLARS AND PROJECTS, AS WELL AS THE, HERE'S WHAT WE PLAN TO SPEND IN THE COMING YEAR.
AND THAT WAY WE HAVE A CONSULTANT WHO LOOKS AT BOTH.
SO I'M JUST GONNA READ WHAT, WHAT I'VE TYPED IN THERE AS YOU WERE TALKING AND TELL ME IF THIS IS CAPTURES THE, THE SPIRIT, UH, THE RES, THE CITY OF AUSTIN THROUGH THE RESOURCE MANAGEMENT COMMISSION, AND THE AUSTIN CITY COUNCIL SHOULD REQUIRE AN ANNUAL REPORT BY TEXAS GAS SERVICE OF ITS EXPECTED PLANT COSTS, CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS FOR THE COMING YEAR, AND ACTUAL CAPITAL PROJECTS AND EXPENDITURES FOR THE PRECEDING FISCAL YEAR.
OTHER COMMENTS ON THIS SECTION? UH, YES, COMMISSIONER SILVERSIDE.
UM, IN THE MIDDLE BULLET ON PAGE SIX THAT STARTS, THE CITY OF AUSTIN SHOULD REQUIRE, OKAY.
I SUPPORT THE POLICY AND PRINCIPLE THAT WE SHOULD, THAT GAS AS WELL AS ELECTRICITY AND WATER SHOULD HAVE A PROGRESSIVE RESIDENTIAL TO OR GRADE STRUCTURE.
UM, HOWEVER, I DO NOT KNOW WHETHER WE AS A CITY HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO MAKE TEXAS GAS SERVICE CHANGE THE RATE STRUCTURE THAT HAS BEEN APPROVED BY THE RAILROAD COMMISSION TO STATE ANOTHER WAY.
I'M PRETTY SURE WE DON'T, BUT I DON'T KNOW LEGALLY, AND, AND I DID NOT, I APOLOGIZE.
I DID NOT HAVE TIME THIS WEEK TO CALL ANYONE WHO MIGHT BE ABLE TO ANSWER THAT QUESTION.
SO ALTHOUGH I SUPPORT THIS IN PRINCIPLE, I THINK AS AN ACTUAL PRACTICAL MATTER, IT'S A NON-STARTER.
ARE YOU PRO PROPOSING TO REMOVE THIS BULLET? I'M PROPOSING THAT WE NEED MORE INFORMATION BEFORE I'M COMFORTABLE VOTING FOR IT.
I DON'T KNOW THAT WE'RE GOING AND I ENCOURAGE YOU GUYS TO BE CAUTIOUS AS WELL.
UH, COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ, UH, I'M JUST CURIOUS, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, IF YOU PUTTING IT IN THIS RESOLUTION, WOULD THERE BE A DOWNSIDE TO DOING THAT? IF THE CITY'S NOT ABLE TO ASK FOR IT IN THE NEGOTIATION, THEY WON'T ASK FOR IT.
WHAT, WHAT WOULD BE LIKE, HOW WOULD YOU SAY THAT? YEAH.
I, I, I THINK THAT THE CITY WILL, IF THIS STAYS IN, IN HERE, UM, THAT THE, SEE, THE FOLKS WHO ACTUALLY DO THE NEGOTIATION WILL SAY, BOY, THAT WAS A STUPID INCLUSION BY THE RAILROAD, BY BY THE, THE RESOURCE MANAGEMENT COMMISSION.
THOSE DUMMY SHOULD HAVE KNOWN BETTER, BUT THEY WOULD DELETE IT AND THEY WOULDN'T ASK FOR IT.
SO IT WOULD NOT, IT WOULD NOT PERSIST.
I I DO NOT, I I, I WOULD LIKE TO AVOID HAVING BOTH CITY STAFF AND THE CITY COUNCIL THINK THAT WE'RE DUMMIES WHO CAME IN AND RECOMMENDED STUFF THAT THAT COULD NOT BE IMPLEMENTED.
VICE CHAIR ROBBINS, TWO THINGS.
FIRST, IT HAS BEEN REPEATED SEVERAL TIMES BY, UH, MARIA NORTON AND OTHERS WITH THE CITY THAT WE REALLY NEED TO HAVE SOMETHING TO THEM THIS MONTH.
AND, AND THAT'S WHY WE'RE DOING THIS TONIGHT.
AND SO IF WE DON'T PASS SOMETHING TONIGHT, THEN IT REALLY DOESN'T GET CONSIDERED IN OUR RECOMMENDATION.
UH, NOW TO YOUR POINT THAT, UM, UM, ARE THEY GOING TO CONSIDER US DUMMIES? WELL, THAT'S A FULL DEEP PHILOSOPHICAL QUESTION.
AND IF WE ARE MAKING A RECOMMENDATION BASED ON TIME CONSTRAINTS, I DON'T THINK WE'RE GOING TO BE THAT HISTORY OR THE CITY COUNCIL WILL JUDGE US TOO HARSHLY.
AND, AND I, I, I ALWAYS LISTEN TO WHAT YOU SAY, UH, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN.
UH, BUT UM, IT WOULD SEEM TO ME, SINCE THIS IS A FRANCHISE AGREEMENT, THAT IT MIGHT AT LEAST BE PLAUSIBLE THAT IT WOULD REQUIRE A SPECIAL, IT IS LIKE, OKAY, TEXAS GAS ER, PRESUMING TEXAS GAS SERVICE AGREES
[01:10:01]
IN THE FRANCHISE TO DO THIS, THEN THERE WOULD HAVE TO BE A RATE CASE.UH, AND IT WOULD INVOLVE NOT THE RATE OF RETURN, NOT THE AMOUNT OF MONEY DUE, BUT SIMPLY RESTRUCTURING THE RATE SO THAT THERE IS A TIERED RATE SYSTEM, BUT THAT THE UTILITY IS OTHERWISE MADE WHOLE BASED ON THE ADJUDICATION OF THE 2025 RATE CASE.
UH, I'M PROBABLY GETTING TOO COMPLICATED.
I THINK THAT IF THERE WERE A RATE CASE HELD AFTER THE FACT, JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT TEXAS GAS SERVICE HAD THEIR COSTS COVERED, THAT THIS WOULD NOT BE, UH, OUT OF QUESTION.
UM, I DID SEE, I DID SEE COMMISSIONER GARRY'S HAND.
I'D LIKE TO RECOGNIZE COMMISSIONER GARRY.
SO, UM, I'M FURTHER UP WHERE IT SAYS THE CONSULTANT SHOULD BE FUNDED WITH EITHER AN INCREASED FRANCHISE FEE.
AND, AND I THINK WE TOUCHED ON IT BRIEFLY, BUT I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE I HEARD CORRECTLY.
SO THIS FRAN, THIS INCREASE IN FRANCHISE FEE, WHO IS THAT FEE COMING FROM? WHO WILL BE CHARGED AT FREE FEE? THE RATE PAYERS? YEAH.
I DON'T, I DON'T THINK I LIKE THAT.
'CAUSE WE ARE, WE'RE TRYING TO REDUCE COST, BUT THEN WE'RE ASKING THEM TO PAY, UM, ADDITIONAL FEES.
THANK YOU FOR ANSWERING MY QUESTION.
I HAVE, HAVE A, UM, PROPOSED SOLUTION HERE.
I WOULD LIKE TO MODIFY, UM, WITH RESPECT TO, TO, TO VICE CHAIR ROBIN'S COMMENT ABOUT THEIR TIERED RATE STRUCTURE.
THEY ALREADY HAVE A TIERED RATE STRUCTURE.
WE'RE LOOKING FOR A DIFFERENT TIERED RATE STRUCTURE.
MY PROPOSAL IS THAT WE MODIFY THIS PARTICULAR BULLET TO SAY RATHER THAN THAT WE ARE REQUIRING ANYTHING.
I WOULD LIKE THIS TO READ AS A POLICY MATTER.
THE CITY OF AUSTIN PREFERS THAT TEXAS GAS SERVICE IMPLEMENT A PROGRESSIVE RESIDENTIAL TIERED RATE STRUCTURE WITH NO LESS THAN THREE TIERS.
AND THAT WAY WE ARE ASSERTING A, A, WE ARE ASSERTING A POLICY PREFERENCE, BUT NOT TRYING TO ASK FOR SOMETHING THAT MAY BE REGULATORILY.
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S THE WORD.
DOES THAT WORK FOR PEOPLE? YES.
DO I NEED TO SCORE, DO I NEED TO INVENT THAT AGAIN, THAT LANGUAGE OR, UH, I HAVE TYPED IT UP HERE.
LET ME READ IT OUT LOUD FOR EVERYONE JUST TO MAKE SURE I CAPTURE THAT CORRECTLY.
AS A POLICY MATTER, THE CITY OF AUSTIN PREFERS THE TEXAS GAS SERVICE IMPLEMENT, TAKE OUT THAT TOO.
A PROGRESSIVE RESIDENTIAL TIERED RATE STRUCTURE WITH NO LESS THAN THREE TIERS.
IS THERE ANY NEW COMMENTARY? UH, YES.
I JUST HAVE A REALLY QUICK POINT.
PREFER SOUNDS A LITTLE BIT GENTLE.
UM,
UH, AND THEN THIS IS WOULD BE THE RMC RECOMMENDS NO, NO.
THE CITY, THE CITY RECOMMENDS THE TEXAS GAS.
SO THE, THE, I JUST WANNA, THE RESOURCE MANAGEMENT COMMISSION RECOMMENDS THAT THE CITY RECOMMENDS NO, NO, AS YOU WROTE IT THERE, THE CITY, IT IS JUST THAT THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE WORD PREFERS AND, AND RECOMMEND.
I I PROBABLY SHOULD HAVE SAID NOTHING.
ANY OTHER COMMENTARY ON THIS SECTION? UH, AS A REMINDER, WE'LL BE VOTING ON THIS SECTION AS AN AMENDMENT AS A WHOLE.
SO WE HAVE, UH, CAPITAL RECOVERY FEES FOR NEW HOOKUPS IN THE SAME MANNER, AND EMPLOYEES FROM MUNICIPAL AND ELECTRIC WATER UTILITY.
UM, WE HAVE THE CONSULTANT, THE ANNUAL REPORT OF EXPECTED PLANT COSTS AND ACTUAL CAPITAL PROJECTS AND EXPENDITURES.
WE HAVE THE CONSULTANT TO REVIEW, FUNDED BY EITHER A FRANCHISE FEE OR BILL RIDER, SIMILAR TO THE CONSERVATION ADJUSTMENT CHARGE.
THE ENCOURAGE OTHER LARGE CITIES TO BE TO CO-FUND THIS CONSULTANT.
FINANCIAL PENALTIES FOR NON-COMPLIANCE, UH, AND RECOMMENDS
[01:15:01]
A PROGRESSIVE RESIDENTIAL RATE, TIERED STRUCTURE.I'M GONNA CALL A VOTE ON THIS AMENDMENT ON SECTION ON SECTION 1.1 2.1.
ALL IN FAVOR OF ADOPTING THE AMENDMENT.
ALL OPPOSED? UH, COMMISSIONER GARY OPPOSES THAT THIS AMENDMENT CARRIES NINE TO ONE.
THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH FOR THIS.
THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH FOR THIS
ALRIGHT, NUMBER, UH, THE NEXT SECTION IS LOW INCOME ASSISTANCE.
DO I HEAR A MOTION? SO, MOVE SECOND.
SO, UM, SECTION ON LOW INCOME ASSISTANCE, THE WHEREAS CLAUSES HAVE NOT CHANGED SINCE WE LAST DISCUSSED.
UM, AND THEN WE'LL MOVE DOWN TO THE RECOMMENDATIONS.
AND THE ONLY CHANGE FROM LAST MONTH'S RECOMMENDATION WAS THAT THE PROGRAM COULD BE FUNDED WITH AN INCREASED FRANCHISE FEE, A BILL, RIDER OR MODIFIED RATE STRUCTURE.
AND THAT IS FOR, UH, AN INCOME QUALIFIED MONTHLY CUSTOMER ASSISTANCE PROGRAM TO ENROLL AT LEAST 7% OF RATE PAYERS.
AND THEN SEPARATELY, UH, THE CITY SHOULD REQUIRE TGS TO FUND AT LEAST $500,000 FOR INCOME QUALIFIED EMERGENCY BILL ASSISTANCE, DISCUSSION, QUESTIONS, COMMENTS, RECOMMENDED CHANGES.
UH, VICE CHAIR, ROBBINS, UM, THIS, THESE NUMBERS, THE 7% WAS, CAME FROM THE LEVEL OF CUSTOMER ASSISTANCE PROGRAM FOR AUSTIN ENERGY AND AUSTIN WATER IN ABOUT THE YEAR 2020, OR EXCUSE ME, 2021 OR 2022.
UH, AND YOU COULD ARGUE THAT IT SHOULD BE MORE, BUT WE GOTTA START SOMEWHERE.
LET'S SEE IF WE CAN GET THERE.
UH, SECOND, REGARDING THE HALF MILLION DOLLARS, UH, FOR INCOME QUALIFIED EMERGENCY BILL ASSISTANCE WITH HALF THE MONEY COMING FROM THE SHAREHOLDERS RIGHT NOW, OR EXCUSE ME, IN 2024, IT WAS FOR $200,000, UH, FOR THE ENTIRE REGION, WHICH STRETCHES FROM AUSTIN TO PORT ARTHUR.
UH, I, THIS IS BASED ON, UH, UM, IF YOU LOOK AT THE HUGE AMOUNT OF MONEY SPENT ON THE PLUS ONE PROGRAM FOR AUSTIN ENERGY, UH, WHICH IS THEIR EMERGENCY BILL ASSISTANCE PROGRAM, THERE'S PLENTY OF NEED.
UH, IF THE MONEY BY SOME FLUKE DOES NOT GET SPENT, THEN IT JUST ROLLS OVER INTO NEXT YEAR.
SO, UH, WITH THAT, UM, I'D ENCOURAGE YOUR, UH, ENDORSEMENT OF THIS.
ANY QUESTIONS? YES, BUT, UH, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, THANK YOU.
SORRY TO INTERRUPT YOUR DINNER, MR. GRAHAM.
BUT ANOTHER QUESTION AND, AND, AND I'M SORRY THAT YOU'RE EATING DINNER FROM A VENDING MACHINE.
WHAT DOES IT SAY ON THIS TOPIC? MY RECOLLECTION IS YOU GUYS GOT HOSED ON YOUR PROPOSAL FOR THIS AS WELL.
THERE'S $200,000, UM, FROM SHAREHOLDERS FOR THE ENTIRE STATE THAT IS STILL IN THE PROPOSAL FOR DECISION.
THIS IS A RECOMMENDATION FROM THE ADMINISTRATIVE LAW JUDGE TO THE COMMISSIONERS.
UM, BUT WE HAD $550,000, UH, IN ASSISTANCE FOR BUILT INTO RATES, AND THAT WAS STRIPPED OUT.
SO AT THE MOMENT, THE, ASSUMING THAT WHAT'S BEEN PROPOSED IS ADOPTED, IT'S ONLY 200,000.
AND IT IS, THAT IS FOR THE STATE, NOT JUST FOR, WE DID HAVE THE CENTRAL GULF SERVICE AREA PREVIOUSLY.
IS THERE OTHER DISCUSSION ON THIS ITEM?
[01:20:02]
HEARING NONE WILL CALL THE QUESTION.ALL IN FAVOR OF ADOPTING THE LOW INCOME ASSISTANCE SECTION AMENDMENT OF THIS RECOMMENDATION, PLEASE RAISE YOUR HAND.
NINE, 10, UH, THIS ONE IS ADOPTED.
NEXT SECTION IS HIGH FUEL COST, UH, IS 1.3 2.3.
THERE IS NO CHANGE TO, UH, THE WHEREAS CLAUSE.
UM, AND THE ONLY CHANGE TO THIS SECTION IS TO ADD, UM, A PHRASE PURCHASED GAS COSTS SO THAT TGS AND THE CITY SHOULD INVESTIGATE WAYS TO LOWER PURCHASE GAS COSTS AND THEN GAS STORAGE COSTS, DEMAND FEES, AND RESERVATION FEES TO HISTORICAL LEVELS.
AND THE REST OF THE CONTENT HAS BEEN PROPOSED TO BE STRICKEN.
UH, THE, SPECIFICALLY THE INCLUDING OWNERSHIP OF INFRASTRUCTURE, UM, SUCH AS GAS STORAGE SYSTEMS, ET CETERA, VICE CHAIR, ROBBINS, I, I SO MOVE AND, UH, IF IT'S SECONDED, I'D LIKE TO OFFER A, UM, I I'D LIKE TO ASK A QUESTION OF MR. GRANT.
UH, WELL, I GUESS YOU COULD SIT THERE AND ANSWER IT, BUT HE'S GETTING EXERCISE TO WORK OFF THOSE SLIM GYMS. YEAH.
UM, I, WE, MOST OF US HERE KNOW THAT GASES A PASS THROUGH COST.
TEXAS GAS SERVICE DOES NOT MAKE ANY MONEY.
NO, NO RATE OF RETURN ON THIS.
SO I GET THAT, BUT STILL, WE ALL KNOW THAT, UH, WE PAY SOMEONE FOR GAS, WHICH HAS GONE UP WAY HIGH.
AND, UH, BASED ON INFORMATION THAT TEXAS GAS SERVICE HAS GIVEN US, IT HAS SHOWN THAT THE FUEL ITSELF HAS GONE DOWN IN THE PAST YEAR OR TWO.
BUT THE STORAGE COSTS AND DEMAND FEES HAVE SKYROCKETED, GONE UP DOUBLE, EXCUSE ME, TRIPLE OR QUADRUPLE.
AND THIS IS, UH, UH, I DO NOT UNDERSTAND WHY THIS IS HAPPENING.
UH, I'M NOT AN EXPERT AND I DO NOT KNOW YET ABOUT STRATEGIES TO GET STORAGE AND DEMAND RESERVATION UNDER CONTROL.
AND THIS IS A, THIS IS ACTUALLY A QUESTION.
UH, ARE STORAGE AND DEMAND COSTS CHARGED TO TRANSPORT, UH, GAS CUSTOMERS? BECAUSE INFORMATION THAT, UH, YOU'VE GIVEN TO THE CITY MAKES ME THINK THAT.
SO WE, I ANSWERED MARIA'S QUESTION, I DON'T KNOW, LATE THIS AFTERNOON, AND I DON'T KNOW IF SHE HAD A CHANCE TO SEND IT TO YOU, BUT I DID, I DID EXCHANGE EMAILS WITH OUR GAS SUPPLY MANAGER.
SO NO TRANSPORT CUSTOMERS ARE PURCHASING THEIR OWN GAS, RIGHT? WE ARE NOT A PARTY TO THAT TRANSACTION.
SO THOSE FEES, ANY FEES THAT THEY WOULD INCUR, THEY'RE PAYING THEIR SUPPLIER OR THEIR MARKETER.
UM, SO THAT IS NOT ANY OF THE, ANY OF THE FEES THAT THEY MAY HAVE ARE NOT PART OF THE COMPONENT THAT YOU AND I ARE BOTH PAYING.
DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? UH, WHEN I SAY WHAT, WHAT WE CALL SYSTEM SALES, WHICH IS 98% OF THE CUSTOMERS, TRADITIONAL CUSTOMERS THAT WE BUY THE GAS FOR.
SO PAUL, UH, ONE THING, AGAIN, WITH THE CONSOLIDATION OF THE SERVICE AREAS, THERE'S GONNA BE ONE PGA, THE PURCHASE GAS ADJUSTMENT, THE, THE PRICE, THE MONTHLY PRICE THAT PEOPLE PAY FOR THE COMMODITY.
AND I THINK THAT'S GONNA BENEFIT CENTRAL TEXAS AS WELL.
SO, AND, AND, AND PAUL, I AM NOT, I AM NOT AN EXPERT.
I DON'T DEAL WITH THIS EVERY DAY.
I DO KNOW THAT ONE OF THE REASONS THEY HAVE TO PAY THOSE STORAGE FEES IS BECAUSE OF THE VOLATILITY OF THE WEATHER.
SO LOOK AT THIS WEEKEND, IT'S GONNA BE WHAT IN THE TWENTIES, RIGHT? AND SO WE HAVE TO HAVE, MAKE SURE WE HAVE THE CAPACITY TO DELIVER GAS THAT WE'RE GONNA NEED.
IT'S GONNA BE NOT JUST A PEAK DAY, BUT IT'S KIND OF A SUPER PEAK DAY THIS WEEKEND,
[01:25:01]
SATURDAY AND SUNDAY.SO THAT'S A PIECE OF IT AS WELL.
THERE'S OTHER FEES IN THERE AND HONESTLY, I MEAN, WE CAN FIND OUT AND WE'LL SHARE THAT WITH YOU.
I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW WHAT I MEAN, I THINK AT ONE TIME YOU ASKED US AND WE DID GET YOU SOME ANSWER ON THE DIFFERENT COMPONENTS, RIGHT? SO YES.
AND IT SAYS THAT STORAGE COSTS BETWEEN 2020.
SO YOU WANNA KNOW WHY THEY'RE GOING UP? WELL, WE, I MEAN, I, ON, I CAN'T TELL YOU 'CAUSE I'M, I, I DON'T KNOW.
THAT'S NOT WHAT I DO EVERY DAY.
BUT, UM, I MEAN, WE, YOU KNOW, IF, YOU KNOW, WE WE'RE HAPPY TO GET YOU THE INFORMATION, BUT WE, WE HAVE EVERY REASON AND INCENTIVE TO TRY TO HOLD THE COST DOWN, RIGHT? UM, AND SO WE, WE TRY TO, AND, AND LIKE I SAID, I THINK YOU'RE GONNA SEE A, AGAIN, A SMALL DECREASE IN THAT WHEN WE, UM, WHEN IT'S ALL CONSOLIDATED IN, IN THE INTEREST OF GETTING US OUTTA HERE BEFORE MIDNIGHT.
I'M NOT GONNA EXTEND THIS DISCUSSION VERY MUCH.
UH, THIS IS, I I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE'S ANYONE IN THIS ROOM, UH, THAT IS GONNA ARGUE FOR HIGHER GAS COSTS.
UH, I'M JUST SAYING THAT, THAT I'M FLUMMOXED, I'M, I'M VERY CONFUSED BY, BY WHAT'S, WHAT'S BEEN HAPPENING.
ANY OTHER DISCUSSION ON HIGH FUEL COST? OKAY, HEARING NONE, I'LL TAKE A VOTE.
ALL IN FAVOR OF THE AMENDMENT ON HIGH FUEL COSTS, PLEASE RAISE YOUR HAND.
UM, I WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION ON THE FORMER SECTION 1.5 SECURITIZATION COSTS, WHICH HAS BEEN PROPOSED TO BE COMPLETELY REMOVED FROM THIS, UH, RECOMMENDATION.
ALRIGHT, IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION? HEARING NONE.
ALL IN FAVOR OF REMOVING SECURITIZATION COSTS FROM THIS RECOMMENDATION.
UH, ARE THERE ANY ABSTENTIONS? COMMISSIONER? GARY, DID YOU VOTE? I DID.
FOR, FOR WHICH IN FAVOR? WELL, IN FAVOR? YES.
THIS, THIS AMENDMENT PA, WHAT DO I SAY? THIS, IT PASSES TO REMOVE IT.
UM, MOVING ON, UH, THE NEW SECTION.
I WILL HEAR A MOTION TO ADOPT THE SECTION ON FRANCHISE FEES.
UH, DISCUSSION ON SECTION 1.4 AND 2.4 FRANCHISE FEES.
IN THE WHEREAS CLAUSES, UM, THERE, THERE HAS BEEN A PROPOSAL TO REMOVE A, WHEREAS CLAUSE, THE SECOND ONE THAT READS, WHEN FUEL COSTS GO UP, BECAUSE OF PREDATORY FUEL COSTS, THE CITY RECEIVES A WINDFALL FRANCHISE FEE THAT MAGNIFIES THAT FINANCIAL PAIN FOR CONSUMERS.
AND IN THE RECOMMENDATION, UM, FRANCHISE FEE, THERE IS NOW ONE REMAINING BULLET POINT ON CONDUCTING A BENCHMARK STUDY OF LARGE TEXAS CITIES.
AND, UH, THE BULLET POINT AROUND, UH, EXEMPTING FRANCHISE FEES ON FIELD CHARGES, WHEN THEY REACH UN UNEXPECTEDLY HIGH LEVELS OF FORM BILL RELIEF IS PROPOSED TO BE REMOVED.
VICE CHAIR ROBBINS, DO YOU WANNA SPEAK ON THIS AMENDMENT BRIEFLY? UM, THIS BASICALLY, UH, IN, IN THE 2000, IN THE 1986 FRANCHISE, UH, TRANSPORT GAS REALLY WASN'T THAT BIG A PHENOMENON.
AND THEN THE CITY, SHORTLY AFTER THAT STARTED LOSING FRANCHISE FEE REVENUE FROM THE TRANSPORT GAS CUSTOMERS, UH, BECAUSE THEY WEREN'T PART OF GROSS RECEIPTS OF TEXAS GAS SERVICE.
UH, OR, OR EXCUSE ME, SOUTHERN UNION GAS, THE PREDECESSOR TO TEXAS GAS SERVICE.
UH, IN 2006, THE CITY COUNCIL VOTED TO CHANGE THE FRANCHISE TO, UH, COLLECT FRANCHISE FEES FOR TRANSPORT GAS FROM PRIVATE COMPANY ENTITIES, BUT THEY EXEMPTED PUBLIC ENTITIES.
[01:30:01]
THAT THE CITY OF AUSTIN PROVIDES PUBLIC ENTITIES WITH CITY SERVICES, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT THE GENERAL FUND, UH, COULD USE THE MONEY.UH, AND SOMEONE AT CITY STAFF SAID, WELL, I DON'T KNOW PAUL, I DON'T KNOW IF WE DO THAT.
THEN, UH, IT RAISES THE SPECTER OF THE STATE GOVERNMENT THINKING THAT THEY'RE BEING SET UPON BY AUSTIN.
AND SO THIS BASICALLY SAYS, OKAY, LET'S LOOK AT THE, THE LARGE CITIES.
I WOULD SAY THE TOP 10 CITIES.
AND IF THE TOP 10 CITIES ALL HAVE A POLICY OF EXEMPTING PUBLIC ENTITIES, THEN WE LET THINGS GO WITH THE STATUS QUO.
BUT IF AUSTIN IS THE OUTLIER, IF HOUSTON AND DALLAS AND BROWNSVILLE ARE ALL COLLECTING FRANCHISE FEES FROM PUBLIC ENTITIES, THEN WE SHOULD FEELING GOOD COMPANY.
AND THAT'S WHAT THIS IS ABOUT.
SO, PUBLIC ENTITY, IS THAT MOSTLY A CODE WORD FOR, UM, THE STATE OF TEXAS? YES.
OR ARE THERE ANY OTHER PUBLIC ENTITIES THAT WE SHOULD BE AWARE OF? SCHOOL DISTRICTS, COUNTY GOVERNMENT, FEDERAL GOVERNMENT.
I THINK THIS IS A GRAND AMENDMENT AND I SUPPORT IT.
GOSH, I'D SAVE YOU TIME, QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS FROM THE COMMISSIONERS ON THIS, ON THIS AMENDMENT? HEARING NONE.
WE'LL TAKE A VOTE ON THE AMENDMENT ON FRANCHISE FEES IN CONDUCTING A BENCHMARK STUDY OF LARGE TEXAS CITIES.
ALL IN FAVOR OF THIS AMENDMENT, PLEASE RAISE YOUR HAND.
ALRIGHT, NOW I WILL HEAR A MOTION TO ADOPT ENERGY CONSERVATION PROGRAM AMENDMENTS.
VICE CHAIR ROBBINS, TAKE IT AWAY.
FIRST I WANT TO, UM, THANK COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ FOR HIS SAGE INPUT ON SOME OF THESE, UM, IDEAS.
UM, HE'S, UH, REALLY THOUGHT OUT OF THE BOX.
UH, AND BASICALLY, UH, I DON'T WANT TO RE-LITIGATE ALL THE PAST DISCUSSION WE HAVE HAD ON, UH, WHETHER THE CONSERVATION PROGRAMS ARE, UH, THAT TEXAS GAS SERVICE HAS RUN, ARE EFFECTIVE OR NOT.
I HAVE PROVIDED AMPLE EVIDENCE IF COMMISSIONERS, UH, AGREE WITH ME, GREAT.
IF THEY DON'T AGREE WITH ME, THAT'S THEIR OPINION.
UH, BUT I DO NOT BELIEVE THEY HAVE RUN EFFECTIVE PROGRAMS. I THINK THE CITY HAS, UH, COULD, COULD TAKE INCREASED FRANCHISE FEE REVENUES, UH, OR, UH, A BILL WRITER OR BILL WRITER REVENUES, AND DO SOMETHING GOOD WITH THIS MONEY.
UM, WE, UM, THE REST OF THESE, UM, UH, BULLETS, THESE BULLET PROPOSALS HAVE, UM, MORE OR LESS QUANTIFIED, UH, WHY AND HOW THIS SHOULD BE DONE.
UM, AND IF THERE ARE ANY, UH, AND, AND AGAIN, THANK YOU, UH, COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ.
UM, SO THIS IS THE ITEM THAT RECOMMENDS THAT AUSTIN TAKE OVER PLANNING AND MANAGEMENT OF CONSERVATION PROGRAMS AS PART OF THE NEW FRANCHISE AGREEMENTS, UM, WITH TEXAS GAS PAYING FOR THE CONSERVATION PROGRAMS COLLECTED WITH EITHER WITH THE FRANCHISE FEE OR BILL RIDER.
UM, AND THEN, I DON'T KNOW, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, DID YOU HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD TO COMMENTARY ON THIS ONE? I'D LIKE TO OFFER A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT TO THE BOTTOM BULLET ON PAGE SEVEN, PLEASE.
SO TELL ME WHICH ONE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT.
UH, THAT'S ALL PREVIOUSLY COLLECTED CONSERVATION.
UM, AFTER ALL PREVIOUSLY COLLECTED, I WOULD LIKE TO INSERT THE PHRASE, BUT UNSPENT.
[01:35:01]
IT.UH, ANY DISCUSSION? I'M FEELING SOME ENERGY WANING.
IS THE SUGAR RUSH CRASH? WE HAVING A CRASH NOW FROM THAT SUGAR.
I, I KEPT MY DONUT MY CUP UNTIL LATER SO THAT I PUT SUGAR RUSH.
I KNOW I SHOULD HAVE BROUGHT COFFEE.
I'M HEARING NO COMMENTS OR QUESTIONS.
COMMISSIONER KENNER, I A BRIEF ONE, IF I MAY PLEASE.
UM, THAT SECOND SENTENCE, PREVIOUSLY COLLECTED TGS CONSERVATION FUNDS SHOULD BE DIRECTED TOWARDS LOW INCOME HOME WEATHERIZATION.
IS THAT THROUGH FORMAL PROGRAMS? I MEAN, WHAT'S THE, WHAT'S THE SORT OF INTENT THERE? UM, I UNDERSTAND LIKE THE DESIRE TO, THIS IS SOMETHING I'VE, I'VE WORKED ON QUITE A BIT ON.
THERE ARE COMMUNITY ACTION AGENCIES AND OTHER ENTITIES THAT CAN SPEND THE MONEY, BUT, UM, THERE ARE FEW FORMAL PROGRAMS FOR WEATHERIZATION IS RARELY FUNDED ON IT, FUNDED ON ITS OWN.
AND MANY ENERGY EFFICIENCY MEASURES ARE NOT INVESTED IN FOR LOW INCOME CUSTOMERS, SPECIFICALLY BECAUSE THEIR HOME IS NOT IN GOOD ENOUGH CONDITION TO BE ABLE TO, AND THEN GO CAPITAL FRONT.
SO, SO IF THERE IS LEFTOVER CASH YEP.
THAT TGS HAS NOT YET SPENT, THAT IS INTENDED FOR CONSERVATION, THE VIEW IS WE CAN HELP A BUNCH OF LOW INCOME FAMILIES BY WEATHERIZING THOSE PROPERTIES.
SO IT'S, IT'S, THE IDEA IS LET'S USE ESSENTIALLY FOUND MONEY FOR A GOOD PURPOSE THAT ENABLES BETTER USE OF THE REMAINDER ON ADDITIONAL EFFICIENCY FUNDS AND CONSERVATION FUNDS.
SO IT'S, IT'S, YOU KNOW, YOU FIND A PENNY ON THE GROUND, LET'S FIND A GOOD WAY TO SPEND IT, BECAUSE WE WON'T FIND PENNIES ON THE GROUND IF WE FIND $20 BILLS ON THE GROUND.
LET'S USE THEM FOR, FOR A USEFUL PURPOSE.
ANY OTHER COMMENTS, QUESTIONS ON THIS ITEM? YOU'RE READY TO VOTE? ALRIGHT.
UH, ALL IN FAVOR OF THE AMENDMENT AROUND ENERGY CONSERVATION PROGRAMS. PLEASE RAISE YOUR HAND.
ALL OPPOSED, UH, ANY ABSTENTION? OKAY.
THE, THIS AMENDMENT PASSES 9 0 1 WITH ONE ABSTENTION ALL.
THE NEXT SECTION FOR AMENDMENT IS LEAK DETECTION AND REPAIR.
I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION, SO MOVE SECOND.
THIS IS THE LAST ONE OF THIS RECOMMENDATION.
UH, IT WAS NOT DISCUSSED AT THE LAST MEETING.
SO, UM, I WILL JUST GIVE A, UH, AN OVERVIEW.
UM, ESSENTIALLY IF YOU RUN A GAS UTILITY, YOU'RE GONNA HAVE METHANE LEAKS.
IT'S AN INHERENT RISK, AN INHERENT RISK IN, IN THE OPERATION.
UM, IT CAN POSE SAFETY CONCERNS FOR BUSINESS PEOPLE, INFRASTRUCTURE.
UM, IT'S ALSO A VERY POTENT GREENHOUSE GAS.
UM, AND THIS AMENDMENT SAYS THAT IT'S IN THE INTEREST OF THE RESIDENTS OF THE CITY TO HAVE SOME VISIBILITY INTO, UM, WHAT THE FREQUENCY AND SEVERITY OF METHANE LEAKS LOOKS LIKE, UM, OF THE UTILITIES OPERATING IN, IN THE CITIES RIGHT OF WAY.
WHAT ARE THE MITIGATION AND REPAIR PROCEDURES BEING USED? UM, AND SO JUST TO, YOU KNOW, TO KIND OF CODIFY THAT, UH, OUR EXISTING FRANCHISE AGREEMENT, UH, THE CITY'S EXISTING FRANCHISE AGREEMENT WITH TEXAS GAS ONLY, UM, INCLUDES, UH, YOU KNOW, IT'S THE LEAK DETECTION STANDARDS ARE ESTABLISHED BY FEDERAL AND STATE LAW.
AND THEY, THE AGREEMENT ONLY INCLUDES GENERAL PROVISIONS REQUIRING THE UTILITY TO COMPLY.
UM, THIS IS A 10 OR A 20 YEAR, UH, AGREEMENT.
UH, NONE OF US KNOW WHAT THOSE RULES AND REGULATIONS ARE GONNA LOOK LIKE IN 20 YEARS.
SO, UM, THIS IS A, AN ATTEMPT TO SAY, LET'S SHOW THE RESIDENTS WHAT WE'RE DOING.
LET'S STAY AHEAD TECHNOLOGICALLY, UM, LET'S MAKE SURE WE'RE DOING ALL THE PRUDENT THINGS THAT WE CAN TO, TO MITIGATE THIS RISK.
UM, SO I'M GONNA JUMP TO THE SECTION, THE RECOMMENDATION SECTION.
SO THE RE RECOMMENDATION ASKS, UH, THE CITY TO REQUIRE TEXAS GAS TO EMPLOY INDUSTRY LEADING ADVANCED LEAK DETECTION, REPAIR TECHNOLOGIES THROUGHOUT THE TERM OF THE AGREEMENT.
UM, INCLUDING TECHNOLOGIES THAT INCREASE THE SPEED AND SENSITIVITY, EXPAND SEARCH FOOTPRINT, REDUCE RESPONSE TIME, AND INCREASE THE REPAIR SPEED OF LEAKS WITHIN THE CITY.
AND TO REGULARLY UPDATE ITS PRACTICES TO REFLECT TECHNOLOGICAL
[01:40:01]
ADVANCEMENTS, UM, AND SUBMIT ANNUAL REPORTS TO THE CITY ON THE PERFORMANCE OF ITS PROGRAMS. UH, INCLUDING WHAT PRACTICES AND TECHNOLOGIES IT'S EMPLOYING, UH, WHAT THE METHANE EMISSIONS, UH, ARE, AND THE METHANE EMISSIONS RATE, RESPONSE TIME, LEAK REPAIR TIME, UH, AND NUMBER OF LEAKS REPAIRED.AND ANY ANALYSIS OF PATTERNS OF LEAKS FOUND THAT COULD REQUIRE A BROADER SYSTEMATIC APPROACH TO IMPROVING THE GAS SYSTEM'S SAFETY.
AND WITH THAT, I'LL PAUSE FOR QUESTIONS.
VICE CHAIR, ROBBINS, UM, I DON'T HAVE A QUESTION.
I JUST WANT TO COMPLIMENT YOU FOR YOUR WORK ON THIS.
COMMISSIONER FARMER, UM, IS THE MAKEUP OF THE GAS, IS THAT LIKE TRADE SECRET OR PUBLICLY AVAILABLE? LIKE, IT'S NOT PURELY METHANE, RIGHT? THERE'S LIKE OTHER THINGS IN THE GAS TO HELP WITH FLOW AND THAT SORT OF THING.
YEAH, THERE'S, I MEAN, CAN YOU GO TO THE PODIUM TO ANSWER PLEASE? THANK YOU.
THERE IS SOME OTHER THINGS IN IT.
UM, I THINK THERE'S SOME SORT OF FILTERING THAT IS DONE TO MAKE SURE THAT IT'S CLEAN FOR APPLIANCES.
UM, IT'S, THERE'S NOT A TRADE SECRET.
WHAT IS ADDED IS MER CAPTAIN, WHICH PROVIDES THE ODOR.
'CAUSE WHEN IT'S PULLED OUT OF THE GROUND, IT'S ODORLESS.
UM, I MEAN, I WILL SAY WE, WE HAVE A PRETTY ROBUST LEAK DETECTION SYSTEM.
WE USE, WE EMPLOY SOME STATE-OF-THE-ART TECHNOLOGY.
AND I MEAN, YOU GUYS WANNA DO THIS, THIS IS GREAT.
BUT I MEAN, I, I WANT YOU TO KNOW THIS IS SOMETHING THAT THE COMPANY TAKES A LOT OF, I MEAN, WE HAVE EVERY REASON IN THE WORLD TO, UM, MITIGATE LEAKS.
AND, AND AGAIN, YOU KNOW WHAT THE, ONE OF THE BIGGEST COMPONENTS OF THIS IS, UM, REMOVING THE OLD PIPE THAT'S REALLY IN THE, THE CENTRAL PART OF AUSTIN.
AND, YOU KNOW, WE'RE 8% OF THE GREENHOUSE GASES IN AUSTIN, AND THAT'S WHAT'S BURNED, RIGHT? OUR FRIENDS AT AUSTIN ENERGY BUY THREE TIMES MORE GAS IN A YEAR THAN WE DO.
UM, BUT WITH, WITH THE GAS, THE GREENHOUSE GAS COMPONENT IS WHAT'S BURNED AT THE BURNER TIP, AND THEN THEY, UH, LEAKAGE FROM PIPES AND IT'S ESTIMATED BASED ON THE AGE AND THE, THE VINTAGE, THE, THE, THE TYPE OF THE PIPE, RIGHT? SO THE MORE THAT WE REPLACE THAT PIPE, WE, WE HAVE COMPANY-WIDE GOALS TO REDUCE EMISSIONS.
SO I JUST WANT YOU TO KNOW THAT YOU GUYS ARE, YOU KNOW, THIS IS IMPORTANT TO US AND WE FEEL LIKE WE'RE DOING A LOT OF THIS, UM, ALREADY, AND WE HAVE EVERY, LIKE I SAID, EVERY INCENTIVE IN THE WORLD TO REDUCE EMISSIONS AND TO TAKE CARE OF LEAKS.
RIGHT? SO, I DUNNO IF THAT ANSWERS YOUR QUESTION, BUT GO AHEAD.
THEN, THEN THE GOOD NEWS IS YOU'LL HAVE A LOT TO BRAG ABOUT.
AND BY SUBMITTING THESE ANNUAL REPORTS, IT WILL GIVE YOU BETTER PR AND AWARENESS AND APPRECIATION.
I THINK FROM THE GOOD PEOPLE FOR YOUR FINE WORK.
RIGHT? NO, I, I APPRECIATE THAT.
I THINK ONE OF THE THINGS YOU GUYS JUST NEED TO UNDERSTAND, WE'RE A GAS UTILITY IN THREE COMPANIES AND IN TEXAS WE DON'T HAVE, WE DON'T CAPTURE DATA BY CITY, RIGHT? LIKE, ONE OF THE QUESTIONS WAS HOW MUCH DO WE SPEND, RIGHT? WELL, WE DON'T HAVE JUST EMPLOYEES THAT WORK ONLY IN AUSTIN AND THREE EMPLOYEES FOR ROLLING WOOD AND FIVE FOR WESTLAKE HILLS, RIGHT? SO WE DON'T ALWAYS CAPTURE THE DATA, UM, BASED ON, ON THE CITY, WHICH IS WHY SOME OF THIS STUFF IS HARD TO GET YOU THE ANSWERS THAT, THAT YOU WANT.
BUT YEAH, IF, IF WE DO IT, I MEAN, I THINK WE WILL HAVE A LOT TO BE PROUD OF FOR, FOR THIS MATERIAL IN PARTICULAR, IT SHOULD BE PRETTY EASY TO FLAG BASED ON GIS DATA FOR WHERE YOUR EMPLOYEES ARE.
AND, AND I, FOR ONE, WOULD BE PERFECTLY HAPPY IF THE REPORTS ON THIS ARE NOT LIMITED TO WITHIN THE CITY, BUT IN THE AUSTIN REGION.
SO YOU CAN TAKE CREDIT FOR ROLLING WOOD AND, AND ALL THOSE OTHERS TOO IN THESE REPORTS.
ALRIGHT, THANK YOU VICE CHAIR ROBBINS.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? PAUL? ANY QUESTIONS WHILE YOU HAVE ME? NO, NO QUESTION.
I JUST HAD A COMMENT ACTUALLY.
JUST ARE THERE, ARE THERE, JUST TO OUTTA RESPECT FOR MR. GRAHAM, ARE THERE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MR. GRAHAM WHILE HE'S UP THERE AT THE PODIUM? YES.
WITH REGARD TO WHAT YOU SAID, WOULD IT BE EASY, MAKE IT BETTER IF IT SAID
[01:45:01]
WITHIN THE CITY REGION OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT? CITY LIMITS IN THIS LANGUAGE SO YOU'RE NOT HAVING TO PULL OUT ROLLING WOOD AND WESTLAKE AND SUNSET VALLEY? YEAH, I MEAN, YES.IF YOU SAID SOMETHING LIKE, YEAH, THE AUSTIN METRO AREA, OF WHICH 80% OF THOSE CUSTOMERS ARE INSIDE AUSTIN OR 85, BUT IT'S JUST NOT EVERYTHING.
I JUST SAW YOU GUYS AREN'T LIKE A CORNER.
WE HAVE 20,000 CUSTOMERS IN UNINCORPORATED TRAVIS COUNTY, YOU KNOW, SO, OKAY.
SO ARE YOU SAYING IF WE, IF WE REPLACE WHERE, WHERE IT READS THE CITY TO CHANGE THAT TO THE AUSTIN METROPOLITAN AREA? YEAH, THAT'D BE BETTER.
IT'D BE EASIER TO COLLECT DATA THAT WAY.
I TAKE THAT AS A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT.
UH, VICE CHAIR ROBBINS, DID YOU HAVE A COMMENT QUESTION? THE ONLY UH, COMMENT THAT I HAVE, AND A LOT OF PEOPLE KNOW THIS ALREADY, BUT JUST TO STATE IT FOR THE RECORD, IS THAT METHANE IS A MUCH MORE POTENT GREENHOUSE GAS THAN CARBON DIOXIDE.
UH, I BELIEVE THAT THE, THE LATEST FIGURES THAT I SAW, UH, WERE THAT IT IS 23 MORE TIMES 28 WHAT? SORRY? 28.
IT IS 28 MORE TIMES POTENT ON A 100 YEAR TIME SCALE.
THERE ARE VARIOUS SCIENTIFIC OPINIONS, BUT, OKAY.
28 IT IS, UH, SO THAT EVERY, UH, MOLECULE, UH, THAT WE STOP IN THE TEXAS GAS SERVICE SYSTEM IS BASICALLY MULTIPLIED BY 28.
ANY OTHER DISCUSSION ON THIS ITEM? HEARING NONE WILL TAKE A VOTE.
ALL IN FAVOR OF LEAK DETECTION REPAIR AMENDMENT.
COUPLE HOUSEKEEPING THINGS ON THIS, ON THIS RESOLUTION.
UH, FIRST, UH, COMMISSIONER ZIGONG HAS VOLUNTEERED TO, UH, IF SHE STILL HAS THE BANDWIDTH, UH, SHE HAS VOLUNTEERED TO PUT OUT TO HELP WITH A ONE PAGE SUMMARY OF ALL THIS FOR, UH, THE CITY COUNCIL.
UH, AND IF SHE'S STILL WILLING TO DO THIS, I'D LIKE TO, UH, INCLUDE HER.
UM, WHEN WE VOTE ON THIS RECOMMENDATION, WE DON'T HAVE A A ONE PAGE SUMMARY.
IS THAT SOMETHING THAT CAN BE APPENDED TO THE RECOMMENDATION AS IT GOES TO COUNCIL? I THINK THE RECOMMENDATION WILL GO IN THE FORMAT THAT YOU SEND IT TO ME IN, UM, AND AS DISCUSSED.
SO IF YOU WANT TO ADD ANOTHER DOCUMENT MM-HMM.
YOU MAYBE JUST NEED TO SEND THAT TO THE COUNCIL MEMBERS DIRECTLY.
UM, THAT'S, THAT'S KIND OF WHAT I WAS THINKING, UM, BECAUSE WE ARE VOTING ON LANGUAGE AND AMENDMENTS AND ALL OF THIS TOGETHER, SO, UM, I'M TRYING TO THINK WHAT THE BEST WAY THAT MIGHT BE.
MAYBE IT'S SOMETHING THAT IF COMMISSIONER ZI, YOU WANNA PUT IT TOGETHER AND SHARE IT WITH THE COMMISSION, AND THAT WAY THE COMMISSIONERS CAN FORWARD TO THEIR APPOINTING COUNCIL MEMBERS.
UM, I'M ALSO HAPPY TO SEND IT OUT TO THE COUNCIL, UM, ON BE, YOU KNOW, ON BEHALF OF THE RMC.
UM, HOW SOON DOES THIS COME BEFORE THE COMMISSION, BEFORE CITY COUNCIL? BEFORE THE CITY COUNCIL? UH, THAT'S A GREAT QUESTION.
I KNOW THIS, WE WERE ON A TIME CRUNCH TO GET THIS DONE IN JANUARY.
UH, I KNOW THERE IS A, A MAY 7TH CITY COUNCIL MEETING THAT'S A DEADLINE, AND THERE HAS TO BE A FEW READINGS PRIOR TO THAT.
I DON'T HAVE AN EXACT ANSWER FOR YOU.
UM, BUT YEAH, SOONER THE BETTER.
UH, YES, I DON'T WANNA, COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ, UH, UM, DISTRACT.
BUT TO ASK KIND OF A COUNCIL QUESTION, DO WE EXPECT COUNSEL TO VOTE ON THE RESOLUTION OR ADOPT THIS BEFORE MAY? 'CAUSE, MAY IS THE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT APPROVAL? THAT'S THEIR, THEIR IDEA, THEIR IDEA FOR THAT TIMELINE.
BUT ARE WE EXPECTING COUNCIL TO ACT ON THIS LIKE IN TWO WEEKS OR SOMETHING? OR NOT? UM, WELL BEFORE MAY.
I THINK THERE WILL BE SOME DIRECTION THAT COUNCIL GIVES, UH, TO CITY STAFF ON THE, UH, FRANCHISE PRIORITIES.
[01:50:01]
AND I DON'T KNOW EXACTLY WHAT THAT PROCEDURE LOOKS LIKE, WHAT THAT TIMELINE IS.UM, MAYBE ONE OF THE, THE FELLOW COMMISSIONERS KNOWS BETTER THAN THAT, BUT IT'S NOT A, IT'S NOT LIKE A RESOLUTION THAT, THAT THEY'LL ADOPT.
IT'S MORE OF A DIRECTION ON HOW, WHAT THEY WANT TO SEE IN THE FRANCHISE AGREEMENT, IF THAT MAKES SENSE.
VICE-CHAIR, UH, UM, A COUPLE THINGS.
ONE, UH, I APPEARED BEFORE A COUNCIL COMMITTEE RECENTLY, AND I ASKED THAT THEY GIVE US A CHANCE TO SPEAK ON OUR RESOLUTIONS.
SO I'M, AND I'M, UH, ACTUALLY MEETING WITH THE COUNCIL OFFICE TOMORROW.
UH, SO I'M GOING TO ASK AGAIN IF THEY WILL ALLOW, UH, US, UH, TO SPEAK, UM, EXACTLY HOW THAT'S CHOREOGRAPHED.
UH, YOU CAN SPEAK ON OUR BEHALF OR YOU CAN APPOINT SOMEONE, OR SEVERAL OF US CAN SPEAK.
UH, THE ONLY OTHER THING, UM, AND I'M CHEATING HERE, BUT I'M, UH, I WANT TO COMMEND YOU, CHAIR DAVIS.
YOU HAVE STEERED THIS RESOLUTION.
UH, THIS WAS A VERITABLE WHEELBARROW OF FROGS AND YOU CREATED AND, AND, AND YOU CREATED A, UH, SITUATION WHERE WE COULD DO THIS VERY EXPEDITIOUSLY.
SO, UH, THANK YOU AGAIN THAT THANK, THANK YOU.
AND THANKS TO ALL THE COMMISSIONERS WHO, UM, YOU KNOW, PUT IN WORK ON THIS BECAUSE THIS WAS DEFINITELY QUITE A FEAT.
SO BEFORE WE GET TOO HAPPY ON OUR LAURELS, LET'S PLEASE VOTE ON THIS
I WILL ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO ADOPT THIS RECOMMENDATION AS AMENDED.
I'M WAITING FOR PAUL TO, I I SO MOVE
ALL IN FAVOR OF THE RECOMMENDATION ON TEXAS GAS SERVICE FRANCHISE AS AMENDED TONIGHT.
ALL OPPOSED, POSED, UH, ANY ABSTENTION? I'M SORRY, COMMISSIONER GARY, HOW DID YOU VOTE? VOTED YES.
WHEN WE ARE ABLE TO PASS SOMETHING WITH A, WITH A 10 TO, OH, THAT'S A TESTAMENT TO THE COLLABORATION AND THE NEGOTIATION AND COORDINATION THAT THAT'S HAPPENED HERE TONIGHT.
UM, AND FOR MANY WEEKS BEHIND THE SCENES.
SO, UM, I SINCERELY THANK EVERYONE FOR ALL THEIR, ALL THEIR EFFORT AND ENERGY INTO THIS.
[3. Discussion on residential electric rates implemented by Austin Energy and its effects on energy conservation and equity.]
THE FINAL ITEM ON OUR AGENDA IS DISCUSSION ON RESIDENTIAL ELECTRIC RATES IMPLEMENTED BY AUSTIN ENERGY AND ITS EFFECT ON ENERGY CONSERVATION AND EQUITY.I'M GONNA TURN IT OVER TO VICE CHAIR ROBBINS.
UM, DON'T WORRY, THIS IS ABOUT FOUR MINUTES.
UH, COMMISSION THE TERM REGRESSIVE UTILITY RATE.
DESCRIBE THE SITUATION WHERE THE MORE YOU USE, THE LESS YOU PAY PER UNIT.
THIS OPPOSES PROGRESSIVE RATES WHERE THE MORE YOU USE, THE MORE YOU PAY PER UNIT SLIDE.
NOW I HAVE SHOWED THIS IN A PAST PRESENTATION.
THIS IS A GRAPH, UH, COMPARING INCOME TO ENERGY USE.
AND THE LEFT SIDE OF THE AXIS IS THE LOWER INCOME AND THE RIGHT SIDE IS HIGHER.
AND, UM, THIS PARTICULAR STUDY COMES FROM THE ENERGY INFORMATION ADMINISTRATION, BUT THERE HAVE BEEN MANY OTHERS THAT CAME UP WITH SIMILAR RESULTS.
IT'S UNIVERSALLY ACCEPTED IN THE UTILITY INDUSTRY THAT, UH, THE MORE YOU EARN, THE MORE YOU USE SLIDE.
AND SINCE 2012, AUSTIN ENERGY HAS SOUGHT TO WEAKEN ENERGY CONSERVATION AND EXTRACT INCREASES ON LOWER INCOME RATE PAYERS BY MAKING ITS RATES MORE REGRESSIVE SLIDE.
AND IT IS SLIDE THERE AND IT IS SUCCEEDING.
HERE IS HOW THE RATE INCREASES BETWEEN 2022 AND 2026 HAVE AFFECTED EACH COUNCIL DISTRICT.
YOU CAN SEE THAT THE LOWER INCOME DISTRICTS SUCH AS, UH, DISTRICTS 3, 4, 7, AND NINE ARE EXPERIENCING RATE INCREASES BETWEEN 31 AND 34% WHILE DISTRICT 10, THE WEALTHIEST DISTRICT ONLY HAS A 20% INCREASE.
THESE RATE INCREASES ALREADY TAKE INTO ACCOUNT
[01:55:01]
CUSTOMER CUSTOMERS ENROLLED IN THE CUSTOMER ASSISTANCE PROGRAM.UNSUBSIDIZED RATE INCREASES ARE EVEN HIGHER.
WHEN AUSTIN ENERGY ASKED TO INCREASE RATES LAST SUMMER, THEY DID NOT SHOW THIS MAP.
AND I BELIEVE THAT WAS INTENTIONAL SLIDE.
AND WHILE DISTRICTS 10 AND EIGHT HAVE LESS RATE INCREASES ON AVERAGE THAN OTHER DISTRICTS, WHEN YOU DRILL DOWN, YOU FIND THAT THE MAJORITY WITHIN EVERY COUNCIL DISTRICT HAVE ABOVE AVERAGE RATE INCREASES.
UH, AND THIS SHOWS EVERY DISTRICT, UH, DISTRICT 10, THE WEALTHIEST DISTRICT HAS ABOUT 63% THAT ARE, UH, HAVE RATE INCREASES ABOVE AVERAGE.
WHILE THE HIGHEST DISTRICT, UH, HAS 81% WITH RATE INCREASES ABOVE AVERAGE.
IF THIS, UH, CONFUSES YOU, CONSIDER THE SIMPLE FORMULA THAT ABOUT ONE THIRD OF THE RATE PAYERS USE TWO THIRDS OF THE ENERGY AND THOSE WITH LOWER CONSUMPTION, WHICH IS MOST OF US ARE HIT WITH INCREASING REGRESSIVE RATES.
AND WHAT TO DO ABOUT IT IS THAT WE CAN RECOMMEND A COUNCIL TO RETROACTIVELY CHANGE RATES.
UH, WE CAN REVERSE THE RATE STRUCTURE AND SIMPLY PUT AN EQUAL MULTIPLIER ON THE MONTHLY BASE FEE AND EACH OF THE FOUR RATE TIERS FOR THE BALANCE OF THE YEAR.
ALSO GOING FORWARD, AUSTIN ENERGY NEEDS TO SHOW REVISED MAPS LIKE THIS BEFORE ANY SUBSEQUENT RESIDENTIAL RATE INCREASE.
NOW WE'RE ONLY, UH, THAT'S THE CONCLUSION OF THIS SHORT, UH, UM, DIS UM, THAT'S THE CONCLUSION OF THIS PRESENTATION.
UH, THAT WAS EXACTLY FOUR MINUTES
AND SO, UH, WE ARE ONLY SCHEDULED FOR DISCUSSION QUESTIONS AND IF THERE ARE ANY, I'LL BE GLAD TO TAKE THEM IF YOU HAVE JUST GENERAL COMMENTS.
BUT I WOULD LIKE TO BRING THE RESOLUTION ATTACHED TO THIS BACK AT OUR NEXT MEETING TO VOTE.
UM, CAN YOU PLEASE EXPLAIN TO THE COMMISSION, UM, OUR ROLE AS THE RMC OVER THE RATES FOR THE ELECTRIC UTILITY? IF THIS WERE A RATE CASE, WE COULD NOT COMMENT.
WE DO NOT HAVE THE PURVIEW TO SAY WE LOWER THE RESIDENTIAL RATE BY, UH, THIS AMOUNT OR, UM, REAPPORTION IT.
BUT WHAT WE CAN DO IS COMMENT ON RATES AS THEY AFFECT ENERGY CONSERVATION.
UM, BUT ARE YOU PROPOSING, UM, WHAT ARE YOU PROPOSING AS FAR AS THE REMEDY FOR THIS? A CHANGE IN THE RATES THAT WOULD REFLECT, UM, I KNOW THAT THERE'S THAT 1% DELTA, 1% DELTA LANGUAGE, NO MORE THAN 1% BETWEEN COUNCIL DISTRICTS.
ARE YOU PROPOSING TO REDUCE THE, THE INCREASE CUSTOMER CHARGE IN ORDER THAT THAT HAPPENS? OR ARE YOU PROPOSING TO HAVE LIKE A, A DISTRICT LEVEL ADJUSTMENT? UM, I WASN'T SURE HE TOTALLY FOLLOWED IT.
IT WOULD PROBABLY TAKE A MONTH OR TWO TO REPROGRAM THE BILLING COMPUTER AND THEY WOULD HAVE TO, AUSTIN ENERGY WOULD ALSO HAVE TO SEND OUT OFFICIAL NOTICE WHENEVER THEY CHANGED THE RATE.
BUT IT BASICALLY WOULD MEAN THAT THE CURRENT REGRESSIVE RATE STRUCTURE WOULD BE RATCHETED BACK AND THAT, UH, INSTEAD OF, YOU KNOW, WENT UP FROM $15 FOR THE BASE FEE TO 1650, WHICH IS A 10% INCREASE, BUT IT WAS ONLY A 5% INCREASE IN THE TOTAL AMOUNT AS I UNDERSTAND IT, THE, THE TOTAL REVENUE REQUEST.
SO THIS WOULD BASICALLY SAY, OKAY, YOU'RE DOING AWAY WITH THE FORMER RATE AND YOU'RE PUTTING A, WHATEVER THE RATE INCREASE IS, SAY 5%.
5% ON THE BASE FEE, 5% ON TIER ONE,
[02:00:01]
5% ON TIER TWO, TIER THREE, TIER FOUR.SO IT'S NOT, UH, AN ADJUSTMENT TO THE DISTRICT'S TO, TO SOMEHOW CHANGE THE CUSTOMER CHARGE ON A PER DISTRICT LEVEL.
IT'S JUST A, IT'S JUST A CHANGE TO THE REGRESS REGRESSION YES.
REGRESSIVE RATE CHANGE THAT HAPPENED TWO MONTHS AGO E EXACTLY.
UM, UM, SO THANK YOU COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN.
I PARTICULARLY LIKE YOUR SUGGESTION ABOUT REQUIRING THAT THIS DISTRICT BASED ANALYSIS BE PROVIDED WITH EVERY RATE CHANGE REQUEST.
I THINK THIS IS VERY IMPACTFUL AND, AND PARTICULARLY, I I STILL DON'T THINK I UNDERSTAND YOUR PROPOSED REMEDY, BUT I SURE DO THINK THESE MAPS ARE A GOOD THING.
AND WE CAN TALK OFFLINE, UM, AND, AND I CAN, BUT, BUT WHAT I'M PROPOSING, I MEAN, YOU ARE, YOU ARE, UH, HAVE BEEN DOING THIS PROBABLY AS LONG AS I HAVE AND, UH, SO IT, IT, IT, IT WOULD BE A QUICK STUDY.
IT'D BE A VERY QUICK CONVERSATION.
COMMISSIONER, COMMISSIONER KENNER.
BROADLY, THIS IS, THIS SOUNDS GREAT.
UM, I'D LOVE TO SEE SOME SORT OF DISTRIBUTION WITHIN DISTRICT, UH, VERSUS JUST, JUST GRAPHICALLY I CAN'T UNDERSTAND WHAT'S GOING ON BASED ON PERCENTAGES AND WHATEVER, BUT I COULD, IF THERE WAS A, A PROBABILITY DENSITY FUNCTIONAL OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT, I CAN USE THAT.
UM, YEAH, THAT WOULD BE AWESOME.
AND IF WE, THAT COULD BE IN THE LANGUAGE OF, OF JUST MAKING THINGS AS TRANSPARENT AS POSSIBLE.
'CAUSE THEN WE CAN REALLY SEE, UH, EXACTLY WHAT'S GOING ON.
YOU, YOU WANT, LET ME GET THIS, YOU WANT AN EXCEL SPREADSHEET? I'D LOVE AN EXCEL SPREADSHEET.
LET ME PUT THAT ON THE RECORD.
I WOULD LOOK AT IT TOO, BUT WE HAVE TO PROMISE TO NEVER SHOW IT TO THE CITY COUNCIL.
UH, I'M, I'M QUITE CERTAIN IT'LL PASS PROOFREADING.
UH, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S A GOOD IDEA TO PUT IT IN AS AN APPENDIX.
THERE'S A LOT OF SPREADSHEETS, A LOT OF BUSY STUFF.
UH, AND IT, IT DOESN'T NEED TO BE THE WHOLE THING.
IT, IT'S, IT'S REALLY IS YEAH.
JUST ANY EXTRA SORT OF, IT'S THE UNDERLYING DISTRIBUTIONS WITHIN THE DISTRICTS, WHICH IS, WHICH IS THE BIT THAT IT IS SUPER INTERESTING TO ME.
BUT, UM, I, I, PROFESSOR KENARD WANTS TO GEEK OUT ON IT.
THAT IS A LITTLE BIT WHAT'S GOING ON.
I ASKED AUSTIN ENERGY TO GIVE ME THE DISTRICT BREAKDOWN, AND THEN I APPLIED THE 2022 RATES AND THE 2026 RATES.
THIS IS SOMETHING THAT MOST PEOPLE IN THIS, UH, COMMISSION COULD DO IF YOU HAVE THE PATIENCE.
COMMISSIONER FARMER, I MAY HAVE HAVE MISSED IT, BUT WHY, WHY IS THERE, LIKE WHY IS IT NOT A FLAT INCREASE? LIKE WHY DOES THE CITY AND ALL OF AUSTIN ENERGY NOT HAVE THE SAME RATES? THEY, THEY DO.
I THINK IT IS THE EFFECTIVE RATES BASED ON HOW, HOW THE USAGE IN THOSE DIFFERENT DISTRICTS.
SO IF THE RATES ARE, THE RATES ARE THE SAME, THE TIERS ARE USED MM-HMM
BASED ON THE TIERS THAT ARE USED MM-HMM
SORRY, A CHANGE IN THE DEMAND CHARGE FOR ENERGY CHARGES.
WELL, SO THEN, ALL RIGHT, THAT SOUNDS LIKE A TRICKY, SO PROBLEM TO FIX THIS, THIS WOULD, THIS WOULD PROBABLY, AM I CORRECT IN INTERPRETING THESE AS NET BILL IMPACT TOTAL BILL INCREASE RATHER THAN YES, YOU ARE CORRECT.
SO, SO SAYING IT'S A RATE INCREASE IS A LITTLE, IS IS WHY YOU'RE GOING DOWN THE, THE RAT HOLE OF RATE RATHER THAN BILL.
BUT SO IF LOW INCOME RESIDENTS USE LESS ENERGY RIGHT, AS YOUR CHART SHOWS, THEN IT MAKES SENSE THAT HIGHER INCOME RESIDENTS WOULD HAVE A LOWER INCREASE BECAUSE THEY HAVE A BIGGER BILL.
SO THE HOUSES OUT IN, YOU KNOW, NORTHWEST HILLS ARE MUCH BIGGER AND ARE INHERENTLY GONNA BE USING THE HIGHER TIERS.
YEAH, THAT WOULD, I, I GUESS I, I'M, I'M STRUGGLING TO THINK ABOUT LIKE HOW YOU WOULD FLATTEN THAT IN AN EQUITABLE WAY.
I, UH, SIMPLY, UH, A, A FLAT MULTIPLIER RIGHT NOW.
THERE'S FIVE PARTS TO THE BILL.
THERE'S, UH, THE BASE FEE AND THEN THE FOUR TIERS.
WELL, WHEN AUSTIN ENERGY RESTRUCTURED THE RATE, THEY INCREASED THE BASE FEE, THEY INCREASED TIER ONE, BUT THEY DID NOT INCREASE TIERS TWO, THREE, AND FOUR.
YOUR BIG HOMES ARE GOING TO BE USING TIERS TWO, THREE, AND FOUR, SO THEY ARE COMING OUT AHEAD.
[02:05:01]
OR I MEAN, THEY'RE HAVING LOWER PROPORTIONAL BILL INCREASES OR RATE INCREASES.THIS IS A GOOD SEGUE TO MY FUTURE TOPIC AS WELL.
SO I GUESS I, I WILL SEND OUT THE, UH, THE INFORMATION TO EVERYONE AND, UH, I CAN TALK TO FOUR OF YOU WITHOUT, UH, VIOLATING THE OPEN MEETINGS, UH, ACT.
SO, AND, AND I CAN TALK TO ALL OF YOU IF THE QUESTION IS ADDRESSED TO NATASHA AND THEN I CAN ANSWER HER, UH, MS. GOOD, MS. NATASHA GOODWIN.
SO, I MEAN, THE FIRST FOUR OF YOU ARE THE CAN TALK TO ME.
WELL, THANK YOU FOR BRINGING THIS.
I'M GLAD WE HAD TIME TO, UH, TO, TO GO THROUGH THAT.
UM, AND THEN WE CAN KEEP THIS ON AS AN AGENDA ITEM, POTENTIAL ACTION ITEM FOR NEXT MONTH.
[FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS]
BRINGS US TO OUR FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS. UH, I KNOW COMMISSIONER FARMER HAS SOME ITEMS THAT HE'D LIKE TO RAISE.UM, YES, I'D LIKE TO, UH, LOOK AT A RESOLUTION, UH, RELATED TO TIME OF USE, UH, RATES AND DEMAND RESPONSE.
AND, AND IS THAT, ARE YOU LOOKING AT A STAFF BRIEFING, YOU WANNA REQUEST A STAFF BRIEFING OR, UM, I AM GOING TO BE, I THINK I'M GONNA BE BRINGING A DRAFT RESOLUTION FOR DISCUSSION AND OKAY.
I'LL PROBABLY SEND THROUGH SOME QUESTIONS FOR STAFF IN THE MEANTIME.
UM, AND I THINK THIS IS JUST, YOU KNOW, OVER THE COMING MONTHS, I'D LIKE TO TACKLE THAT AND PV AND BATTERIES SORT OF, BUT I THINK WE NEED TO KIND OF PIECEMEAL THEM.
SO THERE'S A FEW DIFFERENT RESOLUTIONS IN THERE ADDRESSING DIFFERENT THINGS, BUT ALL LOOKING AT ESSENTIALLY LIKE HOW CAN WE USE DISTRIBUTED ENERGY RESOURCES YES.
TO HELP OUR DEMAND CURVE AND HELP AUSTIN ENERGY HELP ITSELF TO ALIGN ITSELF BETTER WITH OUR CITY GOALS, WITH OUR GOALS.
UM, SO WHENEVER YOU HAVE, UH, PROPOSED LANGUAGE FOR, UH, AGENDA TOPICS, UM, SEND THEM THROUGH TO MS. GOODWIN.
UM, IF YOU, I, I WILL CO-SPONSOR ANY ITEM THAT A COMMISSIONER WANTS TO, TO BRING.
SO, UM, YOU KNOW, SEND THAT INTO HER BY THE DEADLINES.
AND, UM, AND THEN IF YOU HAVE BACKUP ITEMS TO SHARE TO TRY TO GET THOSE IN TIMELY AS WELL.
I'M WAS GONNA GO SPONSORING JUST
I, I WON'T TAKE, IF YOU WANNA CO-SPONSOR, THAT'S FINE.
I DON'T HAVE TO MONOPOLIZE SPONSORING.
UM, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN AND THEN, UH, COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ.
I WANTED TO, UM, CHECK WITH MS. EVERHART ON THE TIMING OF THE CITY'S THE, THE CITY OF AUSTIN REPORT ON THE DISTRICT COOLING AND HEATING SYSTEM.
IS IT SAFE TO ASSUME THAT AS SOON AS THAT REPORT IS COMPLETED AND IN CITY OF, IN, IN THE CITY ARE THE UTILITIES HANDS THAT WE WILL BE RECEIVING IT AND AND YOU ALL WILL INITIATE PUTTING THAT ON OUR SCHEDULE? YES.
SO I DON'T HAVE TO KEEP ASKING EVERY MONTH.
BUT IT'S GOOD TO KNOW THAT YOU'LL OUT.
I THINK YOU SHOULD AUTOMATICALLY ASKING.
THE, THE OTHER THING I WANTED TO ASK ABOUT IS THE CITY THAT THE UTILITY HAS BEEN WORKING ON A NEW, UM, SORT OF VIRTUAL POWER PLAN AND BATTERY POLICY AND PROGRAM.
AND I'D LIKE TO KNOW WHEN THAT DECISION IS COMPLETED AND HOW SOON WE'LL RECEIVE A BRIEFING ON THAT.
YOU ACTUALLY HAVE A BRIEFING ON THAT NEXT MONTH.
WHAT ELSE DO WE HAVE FOR NEXT MONTH, MS. EVERHART? NEXT MONTH YOU HAVE, OR MS. GOODWIN, I SEE YOU MISSING, UM, THE COMMERCIAL BATTERY PILOT VALUE OF SOLAR PRESENTATION, UM, THE AUSTIN WATER QUARTERLY REPORT AND THEN WELL, WE, I HAVE THE TEXAS GAS ITEM, BUT IT'S DONE.
SO YOU, WE DON'T, WE WON'T HAVE THAT.
COULD YOU REPEAT THAT MIDDLE ONE OR YOU SAID VALUE OF SOLAR? UM, YEAH, THE BATTERY, THE VPP BATTERY PILOT THEN VALUE OF SOLAR.
AND THEN THE AUSTIN WATER QUARTERLY REPORT.
DID YOU SAY THAT THE, AND IS THE DISCUSSION ON THE RESIDENTIAL ELECTRIC RATES COMING BACK NEXT MONTH AS WELL? YES, MA'AM.
DID, DID YOU SAY THAT PPP BATTERY IS COMMERCIAL ONLY? IS THAT RESIDENTIAL AS WELL? UH, IT, IT SAYS CUSTOMER
[02:10:01]
BATTERY, SO I THINK IT'S RESIDENTIAL.ANY OTHER ITEMS FOR FUTURE, FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS? COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ? IS THERE A, A SOLAR STANDARD OFFER BRIEFING IN THE NEXT FEW MONTHS OR DO YOU KNOW IF YOU HAVE ANYTHING ON THAT? YOU, SO WILL YOU HAVE VALUE OF SOLAR NEXT MONTH? UM, SOLAR STANDARD OFFER, I THINK WE DID ONE WITHIN THE LAST SIX MONTHS, BUT I'LL DOUBLE CHECK ON THAT.
YES, I, I I WAS HOPING THAT, UH, AUSTIN ENERGY COULD GIVE US A, A, UM, RESPONSE TO THE QUESTIONS OF, UH, WHAT A, ACCORDING TO THE LATEST, UM, INVOICE THAT I GOT FROM AUSTIN ENERGY, THERE'S CHARGES FOR TWO THINGS.
I'M VERY CURIOUS ABOUT WHAT THEY ARE.
INFORMATION ABOUT THEM WOULD BE A COMMUNITY BENEFIT CHARGE, NUMBER ONE AND NUMBER TWO, POWER SUPPLY ADJUSTMENT CHARGE.
THOSE TWO THINGS I'M VERY CURIOUS ABOUT.
AND, AND WE CAN TALK OFFLINE TOO, LIKE RIGHT AFTER ABOUT THAT.
I WANTED THEM TO OFFICIALLY BE TALKING ABOUT IT TO US.
JUST FOR THE SAKE OF HEARING THEM SAY IT OUT LOUD AND IT BE, UH, ON RECORD.
AND I HAVE AN ANSWER TO THE, TO THE COST OF SOLAR.
BY THE WAY, ACCORDING TO MY INVOICE HERE, UH, THE ANSWER IS $26 AND 6 CENTS FOR THE LAST MONTH FOR MY NEW SOLAR PANEL SYSTEM THAT I HAD INSTALLED.
SO THAT'S THE VALUE I SEE RIGHT IN THERE FOR REAL.
UM, I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION TO ADJOURN.
SO MOVED BY COMMISSIONER KENARD SECOND.
UH, MEETING IS ADJOURNED, UH, AT 8:16 PM THANK YOU ALL SO MUCH FOR YOUR PARTICIPATION.