Feb 17, 2026 Resource Management

BEFORE YOU, BEFORE YOU LEAVE MR. CO.

THANK, THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR YOUR PRESENTATION.

UM, I WOULD LIKE TO ASK, CAN HIS, UH, SLIDES BE CIRCULATED AROUND TO THE COMMISSION PLEASE? YES.

AND DOES ANYONE ON THE COMMISSION HAVE QUESTIONS FOR OUR SPEAKER? YES.

UM, VICE CHAIR ROBBINS FIRST, WE'RE GONNA BE TAKING SOMETHING UP SIMILAR TO THIS TONIGHT.

UH, LATER ON WE'LL BE DISCUSSING, UH, DIFFERENT KINDS OF RIGHT STRUCTURES.

UH, SECOND, UM, THERE IS A PILOT TIME OF USE, RIGHT? I'VE BEEN ON IT FOR A COUPLE YEARS.

I DOUBT IF THERE'S MORE THAN A COUPLE DOZEN PEOPLE ON IT.

IT WAS LIMITED TO A HUNDRED PEOPLE ORIGINALLY.

I DUNNO IF THAT'S BEEN LIFTED.

I'M SORRY.

IT WAS LIMITED TO A HUNDRED PEOPLE AT FIRST AS A PILOT.

I DUNNO IF IT'S BEEN OPENED UP.

UH, YEAH.

AND IT'S BEEN STUCK THERE.

UM, PEOPLE ON OUR SIDE KEEP BRINGING THE, BRINGING THIS UP TO AUSTIN ENERGY OVER AND OVER AGAIN AND RECOMMENDING, UH, SOUNDLY THAT SOME TYPE OF TIME OF USE RATE BE IMPLEMENTED.

AND IT NEVER IS.

UH, YOU WON'T, I DOUBT YOU'LL HAVE MANY PROBLEMS, UH, GETTING OUR ATTENTION, UH, THE UTILITY, UH, TO BE POLITE.

IT IS NOT THEIR HIGHEST PRIORITY.

AND AT THIS POINT THAT WE, VICE CHAIR IS CORRECT, WE DO HAVE AN ITEM ON TONIGHT'S AGENDA TO, TO DISCUSS THIS.

SO I'LL ASK COMMISSIONERS TO LIMIT THE COMMENTARY AT THIS POINT FOR QUESTIONS FOR THE SPEAKER, PLEASE.

COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, I JUST WANNA THANK YOU FOR, I'D LIKE TO THANK YOU FOR RAISING THESE ISSUES.

IT IS TIMELY.

THEY ARE, UM, YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY CORRECT ON ALL THE POINTS THAT YOU MADE AND, UM, I'D LOOK FORWARD TO WORKING WITH OTHERS TO SEE WHAT PROGRESS WE CAN MAKE ON THESE.

YEAH, I WOULD, MR. FARMER, I WOULD ECHO THAT AND JUST SAY LIKE, LET'S KEEP IN TOUCH.

LIKE WE, THIS IS A THING THAT WE'RE ABOUT TO START TAKING UP AND WANT TO HAMMER ON AND ARE ALL, I THINK, FRUSTRATED ON LACK OF MOVEMENT ON IT AS WELL.

SO WE'D LOVE TO HAVE YOU IN THE MIX IF YOU WANT TO BE IN IT.

YEAH, I, I THINK IT, AS LONG AS IT ALIGNS WITH ALL THE OTHER GOALS, I THINK IT CAN BE SUPPORTED.

I THINK SOME PEOPLE PUSH TOO HARD ON NET METERING OR TIME OF DAY TO REPLACE THE STRUCTURE AND I THINK IT CAN SUPPLEMENT THE STRUCTURE.

I ALSO THINK MOST OF YOU PROBABLY HAVE KNOWLEDGE THAT MAYBE THE OTHER LEADERSHIP DOESN'T HAVE AS FAR AS WHY TIME OF USE CAN ACTUALLY SAVE EVERYONE MONEY, NOT JUST THE PEOPLE CHANGING THEIR BEHAVIOR.

THANK YOU SO MUCH FOR COMING OUT TONIGHT.

APPRECIATE THAT.

MOVE TO APPROVAL OF THE MINUTES.

UM, SO THAT CONCLUDES THIS PUBLIC COMMENT PORTION.

WE WILL

[1. Approve the minutes of the Resource Management Commission Meeting on January 20, 2026.]

SO MOVE FROM JANUARY MEETING.

MINUTES FROM THE JANUARY 20TH, 2026 MEETING, PLEASE RAISE YOUR HAND, UH, UNANIMOUS.

UH, SECOND.

ALRIGHT, WE HAVE MOTION A SECOND TO, UH, APPROVE THE MINUTES.

DO WE HAVE ANY DISCUSSION ON LAST MONTH'S MINUTES? OKAY, THEN CALLING THE QUESTION, ALL IN FAVOR OF ADOPTING THE

[00:10:01]

THE MINUTES ARE ADOPTED.

[3. Staff briefing on Water Management Strategy Implementation Report Highlights by Kevin Kluge, Water Conservation Division Manager, Austin Water.]

GOOD EVENING, COMMISSIONERS.

UH, AT THIS POINT WE ARE GOING TO, UM, CHANGE THE AGENDA AND MOVE INTO THE STAFF BRIEFINGS FIRST.

AND WE'RE GONNA GO NEXT TO THREE, FOUR, UH, THEN COME BACK TO TWO AND THEN FIVE.

SO, UM, CAN WE HAVE THE, UM, MR. KLUGE COME UP AND GIVE THE STAFF BRIEFING ON WATER MANAGEMENT STRATEGY, PLEASE.

ALL RIGHT.

MY NAME IS KEVIN CLUEY.

I'M THE WATER CONSERVATION DIVISION MANAGER AT AUSTIN WATER.

AND THANK YOU DAVID FOR BRINGING THAT UP TONIGHT.

I'M HERE TO BRIEF YOU ON THE WATER MANAGEMENT STRATEGY IMPLEMENTATION IN THE FOURTH QUARTER OF 2025.

AND THERE'S A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT, UH, FORMAT THAT WE'RE STARTING WITH, UH, THIS YEAR IN WHICH MY BRIEFING IS ACTUALLY INTENDED TO BE BRIEF.

UM, THE FULL IMPLEMENTATION REPORT IS STILL BEING CREATED AND REVIEWED BY AUSTIN WATER LEADERSHIP AND IS IN YOUR PACKET.

THAT'S THE 20 SLIDE IMPLEMENTATION REPORT THAT I'VE GONE THROUGH BEFORE.

UH, BUT IN TERMS OF A BRIEFING, WE'RE GONNA START WITH A SIX SLIDE DECK WHERE, IN WHICH I'M GONNA JUST HIT SOME OF THE HIGHLIGHTS FROM Q4 OF LAST YEAR.

IF YOU HAVE QUESTIONS BEYOND WHAT I PRESENT HERE, UM, WE HAVE THE SLIDES THAT WE COULD PULL UP OR WE CAN GO BACK AND TALK FURTHER ON ANY OF THOSE.

BUT, UH, INITIALLY I'M JUST GONNA HIT THE HIGHLIGHTS WITH THIS SIXTH SLIDE DECK HERE.

THAT WE ARE GONNA GO FORWARD WITH THEM INTO 2026.

UH, Q4 OF 2025.

THAT WAS OCTOBER, NOVEMBER, DECEMBER, YOU MAY RECALL.

BACK THEN OCTOBER WAS A PRETTY HOT MONTH, HOT AND DRY.

IT WAS KIND OF AN EXTENSION OF SEPTEMBER, UH, WHERE IRRIGATION WENT INTO OCTOBER AND ONLY INTO NOVEMBER AND DECEMBER.

DID IT COOL OFF ENOUGH WHERE WE SAW SOME, UH, REDUCTION IN, IN IRRIGATION.

UH, SEPTEMBER IS ACTUALLY WHEN WE LEFT DROUGHT STAGE TWO AND WENT BACK TO OUR NON DROUGHT CONSERVATION STAGE.

SO IT WASN'T THAT LONG AGO THAT WE WERE STILL IN, IN DROUGHT STAGE TWO, BUT FOR Q4 OF 2025, WE WERE NOT IN ANY DROUGHT STAGE.

UH, THE LAKES WERE ABOUT 80% FULL IN TERMS OF STORAGE FOR LAKES, BUCHANAN AND LAKES LAKE TRAVIS.

AND IT STILL REMAINS ABOUT THAT SITUATION.

SO WE HAVE ABOUT 80% OF OUR WATER SUPPLY, WHICH IS, IS KIND OF, UH, IRONIC CONSIDERING HYDROLOGICALLY IN TERMS OF RAINFALL.

UH, TRAVIS COUNTY IS CONSIDERED TO BE IN SEVERE DROUGHT, SO WE GOT A LOT OF WATER IN THE RESERVOIRS, UH, BUT ARE STILL PRETTY DRY ON THE GROUND.

UH, NEXT SLIDE, DAVID.

ALRIGHT.

SOME OF THE Q4 HIGHLIGHTS OUTTA THE IMPLEMENTATION REPORT.

FIRST OF ALL, OCTOBER OF 2025 WAS A ONE YEAR ANNIVERSARY OF STARTING TO DO IN GROUND IRRIGATION INSPECTIONS FOR NEW HOMES.

SO, UH, STARTING IN OCTOBER OF 2024, AUSTIN WATER STAFF ACTUALLY WENT OUT AND DID IRRIGATION INSPECTIONS TO MAKE SURE THOSE IRRIGATION SYSTEMS MET STATE AND AUSTIN CODE.

UM, SO IT WAS KIND OF ROUGH TO BEGIN WITH, AS YOU MIGHT IMAGINE WHENEVER YOU START NEW INSPECTIONS.

BUT OVER THE YEAR, UH, WE'VE, OUR INSPECTORS HAVE WORKED A LOT OF THE I IRRIGATORS, UH, TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY'RE TRYING TO GET IT IN CORRECT THE FIRST TIME.

AND I THINK THAT'S REALLY MADE A BIG DIFFERENCE IN THE QUALITY OF THE IRRIGATION SYSTEMS THAT NEW HOMEOWNERS NOW RECEIVE IN AUSTIN.

UH, SECOND BULLET OVER 30 MILLION GALLONS WAS SAVED IN PARTICIPATION FOR REBATE PROGRAMS. AND I POINT THAT OUT 'CAUSE THAT'S A FIVE YEAR HIGH.

UH, I STARTED FIVE YEARS AGO AND THAT'S BEEN THE HIGHEST SINCE, SINCE WE STARTED.

UH, SO WE'RE REALLY EXCITED TO GET THAT 30 MILLION GALLONS IN SAVINGS FROM THE REBATE PROGRAMS. UH, AND THEN POSITIONS WERE ADDED FOR A WATER LOSS.

STAFF ARE BECOMING MORE TRAINED.

WE HAVE MORE TRAINED STAFF TO DO WATER LOSS AUDITS, SO WE'RE BULKING THAT UP WITH THE WATER LOSS.

THE MONTHLY HOME WATER USE REPORTS, THESE WERE STARTED TOWARDS THE END OF LAST YEAR WHERE CUSTOMERS RECEIVE A MONTHLY HOME WATER USE REPORT SHOWING HOW MUCH THEY'VE SAVED AND COMPARING THAT TO OTHER TYPICAL HOUSEHOLDS IN AUSTIN WATER.

UM, AND THOSE HAVE BEEN A, A, I THINK, SUCCESS ENOUGH

[00:15:01]

UH, THEY ARE AN A VERY IMPORTANT TOOL.

SO WE'RE LOOKING FORWARD TO CONTINUING THOSE, THOSE ON.

AND THOSE WERE JUST A FEW OF THE PILOTS THAT WE IMPLEMENTED LAST YEAR USING OUR NEW MYX WATER SYSTEM.

UM, WE'RE ABLE TO ENGAGE WITH CUSTOMERS SPECIFICALLY ABOUT IRRIGATION OR TURNING OFF THE IRRIGATION SYSTEM AFTER IT RAINS, WHAT HAVE YOU.

SO LOOKING FORWARD TO CARRYING THAT FORWARD INTO 2026.

AND THEN FINALLY, ONSITE WATER REUSE SYSTEM OPERATOR TRAINING, MAN MANAGER AND CERTIFICATE PROGRAM.

THAT SOUNDS REALLY PRETTY TECHNICAL AND IT IS PRETTY TECHNICAL, BUT IT IS A BIG STEP IN TERMS OF MAKING THAT ONSITE WATER REUSE SUCCESSFUL.

YOU MAY RECALL ALMOST TWO YEARS AGO, UH, WE HAD THE GO PURPLE PROGRAM WHERE WE REQUIRED LARGE COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENTS TO INSTALL ONSITE WATER REUSE.

AND PART OF THE CHALLENGE WAS THAT THESE, UH, DEVELOPERS COMING IN, THESE BUILDING MANAGERS, YOU KNOW, FEW OF THEM KNEW HOW TO OPERATE AN ONSITE WATER REUSE SYSTEM.

UM, SO THAT, THAT WAS SOMETHING THAT WE'VE REALLY BEEN LEANING INTO AND THIS GIVES AN OPPORTUNITY TO GET TRAINED PEOPLE, UH, TO WORK ON THOSE ONSITE WATER REUSE, UM, COMPONENTS OF THESE NEW COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENTS.

ALRIGHT, NEXT SLIDE, DAVID.

UM, SO ONE OF THE HIGHLIGHTS SLIDES THAT WE'RE, WE'RE BRINGING TONIGHT IS THE GALLONS PER CAPITA DAILY, UH, THE PER PERSON WATER USE.

THAT'S ALWAYS, UM, ALWAYS AN INTERESTING SLIDE TO LOOK AT.

IN Q4 OF 2025, OUR PER PERSON WATER USE WAS 126.

UM, NOW THAT CERTAINLY WAS DOWN FROM OUR Q3, WHICH IS THE HIGH SUMMER JULY, UM, JUNE, JULY, I'M SORRY, JULY, SEPTEMBER, OKAY.

JUNE, JULY, AUGUST, JULY, AUGUST, SEPTEMBER.

THAT WAS HARDER THAN I EXPECTED.

UM, SO IT WAS DOWN FROM ONE 40 CALENDAR YEAR QUARTERS.

WHAT'S THAT? SO YOU'RE COUNTING QUARTERS BY FISCAL YEAR, NOT CALENDAR YEAR.

CALENDAR YEAR.

WAY TO FIND LEAKS IN OUR SYSTEMS. UM, THEY'RE NOT NECESSARILY DEPENDENT ON LONG CONTRACTS WITH EXTERNAL COMPANIES TO COME IN AND DO LARGE SWATHS OF LEAK DETECTION THAT CAN BE UTILIZED BY STAFF IN PARTICULAR AREAS OF CONCERN TO FIND LEAK DETECTION.

SO THE PER PERSON WATER USE WAS, WENT IN Q3 AS 1 41 AND THEN WENT DOWN TO 1 26, WHICH ISN'T THAT UNUSUAL, UH, FOR IT TO GO DOWN.

UH, BUT IT WAS A LITTLE LESS THAN 2024 Q4 BACK IN 2024 Q4, IT WAS 1 21 34 AND IT DROPPED TO 1 26.

SO IT HAS GONE DOWN OVERALL THE YEAR WE ENDED WITH A PER PERSON WATER USE OF 1 28, WHICH IS LESS THAN THE PREVIOUS YEAR OF ONE 30.

SO IT DID GO DOWN A BIT.

NEXT SLIDE.

THIS IS THE SAME, UH, GPCD INFORMATION.

JUST LOOKING ON A MORE LINE GRAPH.

UM, YOU NOTICE, IF YOU NOTICE ON THE FAR RIGHT THERE, WE HAVE STAGE ONE, STAGE TWO, UM, A COUPLE YEARS AND YOU SEE THE BIG SPIKES IN THE SUMMER MONTHS, PARTICULARLY FOR RESIDENTIAL USE.

AND YOU SEE OVER THE LAST TWO YEARS, THOSE SPIKES HAVE MODERATED A LITTLE BIT.

UM, AND THAT'S WHAT WE SAW THIS YEAR WITH THAT LOWER OVERALL GPCD NEXT SLIDE.

AND FINALLY SOME TAKEAWAYS.

UM, AND INTO THE NEXT QUARTER, UH, AGAIN, 1 28 WAS OUR GPCD.

UM, I'D LIKE TO TAKE ALL THE CREDIT AS WATER CONSERVATION, BUT WE DO HAVE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT JULY WE HAD THOSE VERY LARGE RAINS, UM, WHICH BOTH ADDED MOISTURE TO THE SOIL AND COOLED THINGS DOWN FOR A LITTLE BIT.

UM, SO WE HAVE TO ACKNOWLEDGE THAT PROBABLY HAD SOMETHING TO DO WITH IT.

UM, BUT THEN SECONDLY, FUTURE WATER LOSS REDUCTION ACTIVITIES.

SOME OF THE THINGS COMING UP IN THIS NEXT QUARTER, THE CURRENT QUARTER ACTUALLY, AND IN THEN INTO Q2 INCLUDES, UH, 17,000 LINEAR FEET OF LARGE DIAMETER LEAK DETECTION BEING SCHEDULED MAYBE NEXT WEEK OR SO PRETTY SOON.

THE NEXT TWO BULLETS INCLUDE ZONE SCAN, LEAK DETECTION, DEPLOYMENT WITH THE A MI SYSTEM AND THESE INSTALLATION OF ULTRASONIC METERS.

THESE ARE TWO TECHNICAL WAYS TO, UH, DETECT LEAKS WITHIN OUR SYSTEMS THAT ARE REALLY GOING HAND IN HAND WITH OUR NEW, UM, SMART METER SYSTEM, OUR A MI SYSTEM.

AND THEY REALLY REPRESENT A CHANGE TOWARD, TOWARDS A MORE DYNAMIC

[00:20:01]

THEN FOURTH BULLET THERE, CONTINUE PLANNING FOR AQUIFER STORAGE AND RECOVER FIELD TESTING IN EASTERN TRAVIS.

THE UTILITY HAS SHIFTED FROM LOOKING TO BASTROP COUNTY FOR OUR NEW AQUIFER STORAGE AND RECOVERY PROJECT TOWARDS LOOKING TO EASTERN TRAVIS COUNTY TO DO SOME, UM, FIELD TESTING THERE.

AND THEN FINALLY COMING UP INTO QQ THIS QUARTER.

AND THEN Q2, UH, WE'RE GONNA BE IMPLEMENTING SOME NEW ENFORCEMENT ON LANDSCAPE IRRIGATION.

THESE, THERE ARE A NUMBER OF LOCAL AMENDMENTS ADDED TO THE UNIFORM PLUMBING CODE LAST SPRING THAT WE'RE NOW MOVING TOWARDS IMPLEMENTING, INCLUDING LIMITING THE AREA OF LANDSCAPE IRRIGATION FOR NEW SINGLE FAMILY HOMES.

THAT'S BEING LIMITED TO 50% OF THE LANDSCAPE AREA OF THE LOT.

AND THEN ADDING SOME ADDITIONAL CONSERVATION COMPONENTS TO THAT WILL BE REQUIRED TO NEW IRRIGATION SYSTEMS. SO THOSE ARE SOME OF THE HIGHLIGHTS OF THE Q4 2025 REPORT.

HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS.

THANK YOU SO MUCH MR. KLUGE.

UH, ANY QUESTIONS FROM THE COMMISSIONERS? COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN.

THANK YOU MADAM CHAIRMAN.

THANK YOU MR. KLUGE FOR THIS REPORT.

A COUPLE OF QUICK QUESTIONS PLEASE.

FOR CON YOU MENTIONED THAT, UM, CONGRATULATIONS ON HITTING 30 MILLION GALLONS SAVED FOR CONTEXT.

CAN YOU REMIND US HOW, WHAT'S THE TOTAL AUSTIN WATER, ANNUAL WATER USE? IS 30 MILLION A BIG NUMBER OR I MEAN, WHAT'S, WHAT'S THAT AS A FRACTIONAL TERM? I'M NOT REALLY SURE, BUT IT, IT IS, IT IS A LARGE NUMBER FOR REBATES.

BUT IT'S NOT A LARGE NUMBER COMPARED TO OTHER ACTIVITIES.

UM, THANK YOU.

UM, ON, YOU HAVE A RE A DETAILED REPORT THAT FOLLOWS THIS, AND ON PAGES SLIDES FIVE AND SIX OF THAT, WHAT ARE THE METRICS ON YOUR GRAPHS PLEASE? AND ON PAGE SEVEN, DAVID, DO YOU WANNA SHIFT OVER THAT? ARE THOSE DOLLARS OR, OR GALLONS OR MILLIONS OF GALLONS OR MILLIONS OF FACILITIES? UH, SLIDE FIVE FACILITIES IS WATER CONSERVATION METRICS, THE NUMBER OF REBATES THAT ARE GOING ON.

SO, SO THIS IS THE NUMBER OF OF ENTITIES RECEIVING REBATES? CORRECT.

AND SLIDE SEVEN IS ALSO A REBATE PROGRAM, SO THAT'S NUMBER OF ENTITIES RECEIVING, IS THAT CORRECT? UH, IS THAT NUMBER SIX? MUNICIPAL COMMERCIAL REBATE PROGRAMS. OKAY.

IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO? IT S SORRY TO BE A NUDGE, BUT IF YOU GUYS COULD, COULD LIKE FILL IN THE, THE UNITS ON GRAPHS THAT WOULD BE HELPFUL IN THE FUTURE.

UM, AND, AND THEN IN THE FUTURE, WE HAVE TALKED IN THE PAST ABOUT, OR WE'VE STARTED TO TALK ABOUT, UM, AUSTIN WATERS ELECTRICITY USE, AND IT WOULD BE VERY HELPFUL AND INTERESTING TO ME AND PERHAPS TO MY COLLEAGUES IF IN FUTURE REPORTS YOU GUYS COULD DETAIL HOW MUCH ELECTRICITY YOU'RE USING AND WHAT ARE THE TOP ACTIVITIES FOR WHICH YOU ARE USING IT.

I WILL NOTE THAT AUSTIN ENERGY'S LEAD CONSERVATION FOLKS ARE SITTING HERE IN THE ROOM TODAY.

I DON'T KNOW IF THEY TREAT YOU AS A CUSTOMER, BUT I'D SURE LIKE TO FACILITATE THAT ENGAGEMENT.

AND THE, THE LAST THING I'D LIKE TO ASK, AND SORRY TO BOGART THESE QUESTIONS.

HAVE YOU GUYS RECEIVED ANY DATA CENTER SERVICE REQUESTS YET WITH YOUR SERVICE AREA? YOU, I'M NOT SURE TO TELL YOU THE TRUTH.

UM, WOULD, IN, IN YOUR NEXT QUARTERLY REPORT, I'D BE REAL INTERESTED IN SEEING THAT REPORTED AND ALSO YOUR ESTIMATE FOR HOW MUCH SORT OF IN, IN NUMBER OF AVERAGE HOUSEHOLDS TERMS, UM, HOW MANY, HOW MUCH WATER DOES A DATA CENTER WANNA CONSUME? THANK YOU.

BUT TO ME THAT SORT OF SUGGESTS THERE'S NOT MUCH CONTROL, AND CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, BUT NOT MUCH CONTROL OVER HOW MUCH PEOPLE CONSUME.

APPRECIATE IT.

YES, COMMISSIONER KENARD, THANKS VERY MUCH.

AND, UH, APOLOGIES FOR COMING LATE, UH, THIS EVENING AND, UH, TERRIBLE TRAFFIC MANAGEMENT.

WONDER IF YOU MIGHT GO BACK TO SLIDE FOUR, MAYBE THE PROCEEDING ONE BEFORE THAT.

SO THE THING THAT I CAN'T QUITE GET OVER HERE IS THE FACT THAT THE PER PERSON DAILY USAGE IS PRETTY CONSTANT SINCE 2018.

I MEAN, IT'S A BIT OF FLUCTUATION,

[00:25:01]

IS THAT, IS THAT FAIR? I MEAN, EVEN IN THE CONTEXT OF THE, MAYBE THE NEXT SLIDE YOU HAD WHERE YOU GOT THESE SORT OF DROUGHT EVENTS MM-HMM .

FOR ME, THAT WOULD BE LIKE A MOMENT TO LIKE FREAK OUT.

RIGHT? WE'RE RUNNING OUTTA WATER.

WE COULDN'T NECESSARILY SEE LAST JULY COMING.

THAT WAS, IF THAT HADN'T HAPPENED, WE'D GONE ON ANOTHER YEAR.

WHAT, WHAT HAPPENS IF WE'RE IN, IN THAT SORT OF SITUATION WHERE WE DON'T GET ANY WATER AT ALL, GIVEN, GIVEN THE, THE DAILY USAGE IS, IS BASICALLY FLAT FOR THE LAST EIGHT YEARS.

YEAH, YOU'RE, YOU'RE RIGHT.

I MEAN, THE FIRST 1, 20 18, IT WAS LOW AND IT'S BEEN POPPING UP AND IT'S BEEN KIND OF BOUNCING AROUND IN THOSE UPPER ONE TWENTIES OR SO FORTH.

NEXT UP ON OUR AGENDA IS STAFF BRIEFING ON CUSTOMER DEMAND RESPONSE BATTERY PILOT BY HAMAD CHAUDRY, EAGERLY ANTICIPATED.

UNTIL YOU GET TO ONE, UH, 2022 AND 2023, UM, WHERE IT DOES GO UP ABOVE INTO ONE 30.

SO CERTAINLY THE LARGEST DETERMINANT OF WATER USE IS WEATHER, EXTREME HEAT IN 2022 AND 2023.

UH, REALLY PUSHED THAT UP.

UM, AND IT, IT, IT CERTAINLY TAKES A WHILE FOR THE MESSAGING TO BITE INTO, UM, I, THE COMMUNITY'S RESPONSE.

UM, 'CAUSE MAYBE IN 2022, WE STILL HAD A GOOD AMOUNT OF WATER IN THE LAKES, OR AT LEAST ENOUGH THAT YOU DIDN'T SEE THE, THE BATHTUB RING AROUND THERE QUITE SO PROMINENTLY.

UM, SO IT TAKES A WHILE FOR PEOPLE TO REALIZE THAT WE ARE IN A SIGNIFICANT TROUT, BUT THAT'S WHAT, UH, WE ARE ALSO TRYING TO WORK ON.

WHAT ARE THOSE KNOBS TO TURN, UH, PARTICULARLY WHEN YOU GET DOWN TO STAGE THREE MM-HMM .

UH, YOU'RE DOWN TO 40% A YEAR.

DID I MISS A QUESTION? NO, NO.

YOU, YOU, YOU, YOU'RE SPOT ON.

BUT IT'S, UH, IT'S STILL JUST, I KIND OF, YEAH, IT WORRIES ME.

I MEAN, I, I GUESS IT WORRIES EVERYONE.

UM, BUT GUESS THANKS.

OTHER QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS? WELL, THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR THE BRIEFING.

[4. Staff briefing on Customer Demand Response Battery Pilot by Hammad Chaudhry, Director, Energy Efficiency Services, Austin Energy and Lindsey McDougall, Manager, Energy Efficiency Services, Austin Energy.]

I GOOD, GOOD EVENING, COMMISSIONER, UH, CHAIR DAVIS, UH, VICE CHAIR ROBBINS AND COMMISSIONERS.

UH, I'M HAMAD CHOI.

I'M DIRECTOR OF ENERGY EFFICIENCY.

HAPPY NEW TO YOU ALL.

I HAVEN'T BEEN IN, IN THIS MEETING FOR FEW MONTHS, SO HAPPY NEW YEAR.

UH, I'M DIRECTOR OF ENERGY EFFICIENCY HERE AT ENERGY AND I'M JOINED WITH LINDSAY MCDOUGLE HERE.

SHE'S MANAGER OF OUR DEMAND RESPONSE AND TECHNICAL SERVICES.

AND BOTH OF US WILL BE PRESENTING ABOUT OUR, UH, DEMAND RESPONSE BATTERY PILOT PROGRAM, WHICH WE ARE ABOUT TO LAUNCH, AND WE ARE VERY EXCITED ABOUT IT.

HOWEVER, BEFORE I GO INTO THE BETTER DEMAND RESPONSE, I WANTED TO GIVE AN ACCOUNT OF SOME REALLY, UH, EXCITING NEWS, EXCITING THINGS THAT ARE HAPPENING IN THE WORLD OF DEMAND RESPONSE THAT, THAT WE ARE VERY PROUD OF.

UH, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE.

SO, 2025 WAS, UH, AN EXCELLENT YEAR FOR US IN THE DEMAND RESPONSE WORLD.

WE HAD, UH, AMAZING RESULTS.

OUR PROGRAMS PERFORMED VERY WELL.

FOR EXAMPLE, UH, 2025 IS A RECORD YEAR.

UH, WE ARE STILL FINALIZING OUR CALCULATIONS ON HOW DID WE PERFORM, BUT ALL THE INDICATIONS ARE THAT WE HAD THE HIGHEST EVER PERFORMANCE.

AT THIS TIME, WE CAN SAY THAT AT LEAST 57 MEGAWATTS OF, UH, DEMAND RESPONSE OR SUMMER LOAD RESPONSE WAS, UM, UH, UH, WAS, UH, WAS, UM, UH, ACHIEVED BY OUR TEAMS. UH, UH, TO PUT THE THINGS IN PERSPECTIVE, 57 MEGAWATTS MEANS ALMOST 2000 RESIDENTIAL SINGLE FAMILY HOMES THAT WOULD HAVE USED THE SAME KIND OF, UM, UH, UH, POWER AT THE TIME OF THE HIGHEST NEED.

SO THAT'S, UH, THAT'S AN EXCELLENT, UH, PERFORMANCE.

WE ARE STILL, UH, DEVELOPING OUR RESULTS.

UH, WE, UH, WE HAD SOME EXPANSIONS IN 2025.

UH, WE ENROLLED ALL OF THE, ALL OF THE 195 CITY BUILDINGS THAT ARE CAPABLE FOR OF DEMAND RESPONSE, UH, PROGRAMS INTO OUR, UH, INTO, INTO OUR PROGRAM.

THIS IS TO SATISFY THE ORDINANCE IN THE CITY AS, UM, UH, ALL THE, ALL THE BUILDINGS WHICH, UH, ALL THE CITY BUILDINGS THAT CAN TAKE DEMAND RESPONSE TECHNOLOGY SHOULD BE IN THE PROGRAMS. AND THAT'S DONE FURTHER.

WE WERE ABLE TO ENROLL GGM INTO OUR PORTFOLIO AS OUR MANAGED CHARGING PORTFOLIO.

THIS IS, UH, SOMETHING WHICH IS WHY WE ARE VERY EXCITING, EXCITED ABOUT, WE HAVE TESLA ALREADY IN OUR PORTFOLIO.

SO THE MORE MANUFACTURERS, THE MORE OEMS WE CAN BRING IN THE, UH, DEMAND RESPONSE, UH, MANAGED

[00:30:01]

CHARGING PORTFOLIOS, THE MORE EASIER IT IS FOR THE CUSTOMERS TO RESPOND TO OUR EVENTS.

THEN, UH, VERY RECENTLY IN, UH, ON THE, ON THE WEEKEND OF JUNE, JANUARY 16TH, WE PERFORMED A TEST EVENT, DEMAND RESPONSE TEST WHERE WE CALLED AN EVENT, UH, TO ABOUT 7,000 DEVICES, MOSTLY WATER HEATERS AND HEAT PUMPS.

THIS TEST GAVE US, UH, IS, IS, IS GOING TO HELP US DESIGN WINTER DEMAND RESPONSE PROGRAMS. THIS IS ONE OF THE REQUIREMENTS OF US IN THE RESOURCE GENERATION PLAN.

SO WE ARE VERY EXCITED ABOUT THIS TEST.

IT WENT VERY WELL.

WE FIGURED OUT, UH, OUR CAPACITY, OUR CAPABILITY.

THEN FINALLY, WE ARE EXPANDING ON OUR SUCCESS OF DEMAND RESPONSE PROGRAMS AND WE HAVE, UH, VISED OUR INCENTIVE STRATEGY.

WE HAVE INCREASED OUR INCENTIVES.

SO RIGHT NOW OUR CUSTOMERS CAN GET UP TO $155 PER SMART THERMOSTAT IN OUR POWER PARTNER PROGRAM, SEVEN $50 FOR, UM, UH, PURCHASING THE SMART THERMOSTATS, $70 TO ENROLL INTO A DEMAND RESPONSE POWER PARTNER PROGRAM.

AND THEN FURTHER $35 TO STAY IN THE PROGRAM YEAR OVER YEAR.

SO WE ARE REALLY INCENTIVIZING PEOPLE TO NOT ONLY COME IN, NOT ONLY PURCHASE THE, THE THERMOSTATS, STAY IN THE PROGRAM AND ENROLL INTO THE DEMAND RESPONSE PROGRAMS. SO OVERALL, UH, EXCITING YEAR FOR US IN THE DEMAND RESPONSE WORLD.

UH, NEXT SLIDE PLEASE.

SO WHERE DOES, UH, WHY, WHY IS IT IMPORTANT FOR US TO CONTINUE TO EXPAND OUR DEMAND RESPONSE PROGRAM AND WHY ARE WE VERY EXCITED ABOUT THIS PROGRAM AS WELL? UH, THE SUCCESS OF OUR PROGRAMS AS WELL AS THE BATTERY, UH, PILOT WE ARE LAUNCHING.

SO LET ME JUST TAKE THE GROUP BACK TO THE RESOURCE GENERATION PLAN.

THE APPROVED RESOURCE GENERATION PLAN FOR AUS AUSTRALIAN ENERGY HAS FOUR PILLARS AND TWO OF THE PILLARS, UH, PRIORITIZE CUSTOMER ENERGY SOLUTIONS AND FURTHER AGRICULTURE OF INNOVATION.

THEY BOTH HAVE, UH, THE SUCCESS OF THESE PILLARS LARGELY DEPENDS UPON OUR DEMAND RESPONSE PROGRAMS. FOR EXAMPLE, WITHIN THE PRIORITIZED CUSTOMER ENERGY SOLUTIONS, WE HAVE A GOAL OF SUMMER LOAD RESPONSE OF 78 MEGAWATT REDUCTION, OR 78 MEGAWATT OF SUMMER LOAD RESPONS AVAILABILITY BY 2027, WE HAVE A FURTHER STRETCH GOAL FROM THE COMMUNITY OF 102 MEGAWATTS BY 2027.

WITH OUR CURRENT PERFORMANCE AND WHERE THE PROGRAMS ARE HEADING, WE FEEL WE, WE ARE VERY CONFIDENT, UH, IN ACHIEVING THESE GOALS.

WE ARE ALREADY AT 73% OF THIS GOAL BASED UPON OUR 2025 PERFORMANCE.

UH, WITHIN OUR, UH, WITHIN THE FURTHER OF OUR CULTURE OF INNOVATIONS, THERE IS A DISCUSSION OF, UH, COMMUNITY WANTED TO LOOK, WANTED US TO LOOK INTO VIRTUAL POWER PLANTS OR MORE DISTRIBUTOR ENERGY FUTURE.

SO TO THAT POINT, USING THE POWER PARTNER PROGRAM, THE POWER PARTNER EV PROGRAMS, AND THIS IS NEWLY LAUNCHED ON NEWLY A PROGRAM THAT WE ARE ABOUT TO LAUNCH, UH, WITH RESIDENTIAL BATTERIES.

WE BELIEVE WE ARE BUILDING A VIRTUAL POWER PLANT AS EXPECTED OF US.

UM, THIS IS WHERE I WILL HAND OVER TO LINDSAY MCDOUGAL.

SHE WILL EXPLAIN THE GROUP, UH, WHAT, HOW DO WE SEE WHAT IS VIRTUAL POWER PLANT AND HOW WE ARE, UH, IMPLEMENTING DIFFERENT STRATEGIES TO BUILD THIS VIRTUAL POWER PLANT.

THANK YOU HAMAD.

GOOD EVENING COMMISSIONERS.

NEXT SLIDE PLEASE.

ALRIGHT, WE ARE BUILDING OUR VIRTUAL POWER PLANT.

SO AUSTIN ENERGY CURRENTLY HAS A VIRTUAL POWER PLANT.

AND LET ME JUST LEVEL SET A LITTLE BIT.

RIGHT NOW IN THE INDUSTRY, WELL, IN LOAD MANAGEMENT INDUSTRY, THE TERMS DEMAND RESPONSE AND VIRTUAL POWER PLANT ARE MOSTLY INTERCHANGEABLE.

BUT THE VIRTUAL POWER PLANT DOES HAVE A SPECTRUM OF MATURITY.

SO WE'RE IN THE EARLY STAGES OF MATURITY.

AND SO THAT REPRESENTS WHAT WE ALREADY HAVE.

OUR SMART THERMOSTATS, OUR CONTROLLABLE WATER HEATERS, OUR AUTOMATED BUILDING SYSTEMS, THEY'RE ALL CONNECTED TO AN AGGREGATOR.

WE CAN CONTROL THEM.

UM, AS WE MOVE INTO MANAGED CHARGING, WE HAVE DIRECT, UM, WE HAVE A DIRECT CONNECTION TO THAT TELEMETRY AS WE DO WITH THESE RESIDENTIAL BATTERIES.

SO THAT MAKES OUR VPP MORE MATURE, MORE PREDICTABLE, WE CAN FORECAST IT BETTER AND WE'RE MORE CONFIDENT USING THAT TERM VIRTUAL POWER PLANT.

AND SO WHAT'S NEXT IS WE'RE EXCITED TO BRING ON THESE RESIDENTIAL BATTERIES.

WE'RE ABOUT TO LAUNCH A NEW PROGRAM AND WE'RE GOING TO INCLUDE IT INTO OUR PORTFOLIO OF DEMAND RESPONSE PROGRAMS. THE CUSTOMERS WILL BE INCENTIVIZED TO INSTALL NEW BATTERY SYSTEMS AND THEY'LL ALSO RECEIVE PERFORMANCE BASED INCENTIVES FOR HOW WELL THEIR BATTERY PERFORMS. WHEN AUSTIN ENERGY ASKS THAT BATTERY TO PERFORM, THIS WORKS BY AUSTIN ENERGY, HAVING REMOTE CONTROL OF THAT RESIDENTIAL BATTERY, AND WE CAN HAVE INSIGHT INTO THE TELEMETRY THAT THAT BATTERY COLLECTS.

SO AUSTIN ENERGY CAN KNOW THE BATTERY STATE OF CHARGE AND HOW WELL THAT BATTERY PERFORMED.

THIS BENEFITS THE CUSTOMERS BY SUPPORTING GRID RELIABILITY AND CLEAN ENERGY, AND THE CUSTOMERS CAN EARN INCENTIVES WHILE HAVING THAT BACKUP POWER THAT THEY WANT.

NEXT SLIDE

[00:35:01]

PLEASE.

SO THIS SPRING WE ARE OFFERING A BATTERY DEMAND RESPONSE PILOT.

THE INCENTIVE WILL INCLUDE $500 PER CUSTOMER'S BATTERY SYSTEM AND THIS WILL APPLY TO NEWLY INSTALLED BATTERIES.

AUSTIN ENERGY WILL CAP THESE BATTERY SYSTEMS AT 1500 SYSTEMS AND FISCAL YEAR 2026.

HOWEVER, ALL BATTERIES THAT ARE ELIGIBLE CAN SIGN UP FOR THE PERFORMANCE INCENTIVE.

AUSTIN ENERGY WILL PAY $75 PER KW AVERAGED OUT OVER THE COURSE OF THE YEAR.

UM, HOW, BASED ON HOW WELL THEY DO THE, HOW WELL THEIR BATTERY DISCHARGES, THE ELIGIBLE BATTERY MANUFACTURERS TO THIS PROGRAM WILL INCLUDE TESLA, FRANKLIN W SOLARED.

AND SINCE THE TIME OF ME WRITING THIS END PHASE HAS JOINED THE ELIGIBLE MANUFACTURERS, WE, INCLUSIVITY WAS VERY IMPORTANT TO US AS WE DEVELOPED THIS PROGRAM.

SO WE'RE HAPPY THAT MORE MANUFACTURERS WILL COME INTO THE FOLD AS THE PROGRAM GROWS.

WE WILL ALSO BE CLOSELY MONITORING THE COST EFFECTIVENESS OF THIS PROGRAM.

UM, WE WANNA SEE SOCIETAL BENEFITS, UTILITY BENEFITS, CUSTOMER BENEFITS ACROSS THE BOARD AS WE MOVE FORWARD AND AS WE CONTINUE TO OFFER THIS PROGRAM IN THE YEARS AHEAD.

NEXT SLIDE.

WE'RE EXCITED THAT AN E EM AND V CONSULTANT HAS COME ON BOARD AS OF FALL 2025.

AND THAT'S AN EVALUATION MEASUREMENT AND VERIFICATION CONSULTANT.

AND THIS WILL HELP US ARRIVE AT THAT COST EFFECTIVENESS THAT WE WANT TO SEE.

THEY WILL PROVIDE AN INDEPENDENT EXPERTISE TO EVALUATE THE PROGRAM'S PERFORMANCE AND WE WILL BE ABLE TO COME TO AN ACCURATE COST EFFECTIVE ASSESS ASSESSMENT USING OUR OWN PROGRAM DATA.

SO AS WE ROLL OUT THE PROGRAM, WE CAN START INFORMING THE CONSULTANT WITH OUR EXISTING PERFORMANCE DATA AND OUR EXISTING LOAD D LOAD ZONE WITH THE WEATHER THAT WE'RE EXPERIENCING.

ALL THAT HAS AN INFLUENCE ON THE COST EFFECTIVENESS AND THIS WILL ALLOW US TO MAKE STRATEGIC DECISION MAKING BACKED BY RELIABLE EM AND V RESULTS AND WE CAN MAKE CONTINUOUS IMPROVEMENT ON THIS PROGRAM AS WE SEE IT THROUGH TIME.

THAT CONCLUDES MY PORTION OF THE PRESENTATION.

ALRIGHT, THANK YOU SO MUCH MR. CHARE.

MS. MCDOUGALL, UM, I'LL OPEN IT UP TO, UH, THE FLOOR TO COMMISSIONERS THAT HAVE QUESTIONS.

COMMISSIONER FARMER, I'LL JUMP IN.

UM, IS THE EMNV OH FIRST, THANK YOU.

THIS IS EXCITING.

UM, AND TIMELY, UM, IS THE MNV UH, CONSULTANT, IS THAT JUST LOOKING AT THE BATTERY PILOT OR IS THAT LOOKING AT LIKE THE VPP, THE BATTERY PILOT AND THE RESOURCE GEN, LIKE ENERGY EFFICIENCY SORT OF WHOLE SYSTEM? YEAH, SO OUR EVALUATION, MEASUREMENT AND VERIFICATION CONSULTANT IS HELPING US EVALUATE THE ENTIRE PORTFOLIO OF OFFERINGS WE HAVE, NOT ONLY, UH, UH, WHAT WE CALL EXPOSED AS WELL AS ANTE, MEANING WHAT WE HAVE DONE UP UNTIL NOW, THEY ARE LOOKING AT IT FROM THE IMPACT STANDPOINT ARE OUR SAVING METHODS ARE CORRECT OR NOT, THEY'RE CORRECT, BUT HOW DO THEY SEE IT? BUT ALSO WILL BE, UM, ADVISING US ABOUT CHANGING THE INCENTIVE STRATEGIES OR NEW MEASURES AND WHATNOT.

BUT JUST A SHORT ANSWER, THEY'RE LOOKING AT THE ENTIRE PORTFOLIO OF OFFERINGS, UH, AT, AT WITH CES OFFERS.

AND ON THE, ON THE BATTERIES, UM, DO YOU HAVE PROJECTED, UH, INCENTIVE PAYBACK? LIKE WHAT YOU THINK THE $75 KILOWATT IS GONNA PAY OUT FOR LIKE A TYPICAL, IT'S ABOUT $325 PER SYSTEM PER YEAR.

APPETITE FOR A PROGRAM LIKE THIS.

SO IF I WAS TO GET A POWERWALL IN HOUSTON, LIKE IN A DEREGULATED AREA, IT'S ABOUT AN EIGHT YEAR PAYBACK ON THE DEREG MARKET.

SO I THINK THAT'S KIND OF LIKE THE LITMUS TEST THAT I SEE WHERE LIKE WE'RE IN A CITY THAT HAS VERY, UH, LIKE CLEAR GOALS IN TERMS OF DECARBONIZATION AND, YOU KNOW, CLEAN ENERGY.

AND SO IF WE'RE NOT BETTER THAN LIKE THE DEREGULATED MARKET, THEN IT SEEMS LIKE OUR PROGRAM IS ACTUALLY HOLDING US BACK AND DOING THE OPPOSITE OF WHAT IT SHOULD BE DOING.

SO THAT SEEMS LIKE $375 OVER A $17,000 BATTERY SYSTEM IS NOT GONNA PAY ITSELF BACK IN EIGHT YEARS.

RIGHT.

SO WE'RE LOOKING AT LIKE 10 XING THAT OR SOMETHING.

I DON'T KNOW.

SO THAT'S, I DON'T KNOW.

THAT'S LIKE HOW I THINK ABOUT THIS STUFF IS LIKE IF AUSTIN ENERGY IS WORSE THAN THE DEREGULATED MARKET, IT INCREASING BATTERY ADOPTION, THEN THAT MEANS LIKE, WHAT'S WRONG WITH THAT PICTURE? YEAH, WE, WE WENT, WE DID A LOT OF WORK FINDING THE RIGHT INCENTIVE AND IT WAS A COMBINATION BASED ON OUR MARKET AND HOW MANY BATTERIES WE THINK EXIST AND THE

[00:40:01]

ALSO, THE RATES THAT WE SEE ON THE ARC O MARKET, AND WE DID TAKE A SWATH OF JUST COMPETITIVE UTILITIES THAT OFFER SIMILAR PROGRAMS MM-HMM .

AND THAT'S WHERE WE ARRIVED AT IT.

BUT I DID TAKE NOTE OF YOUR, UH, TEST AND, AND FURTHER, JUST TO ADD TO WHAT LINDSAY SAID, IT'S A PILOT PROGRAM.

IT'S THE FIRST ATTEMPT FOR US TO LAUNCH IT.

SO WE WANT TO JUST WALK BEFORE WE RUN.

UM, THERE ARE A LOT OF BATTERIES ALREADY IN THE MARKETPLACE, UM, WHICH WILL BE COMING IN.

IT'S A YEAR LONG PROGRAM.

WE ARE VERY USED TO RUNNING NATION LEADING DEMAND RESPONSE PROGRAM, BUT DEMAND RESPONSE IS JUST IN THE SUMMER.

THIS IS THE FIRST TIME, FIRST INSTANCE WHERE WE WILL BE DOING AN YEAR LONG THING.

UH, SO WE HAVE TO SEE DIFFERENT ASPECTS OF THE PILOT PROGRAM FURTHER, WE WANT TO JUST LEARN FROM THIS PILOT FAIRLY QUICKLY.

I'M NOT TALKING ABOUT LEARNING OVER 3, 4, 5, 6 YEARS.

I'M TALKING ABOUT LEARNING AS WE ARE DOING THE PILOT, AS I NOTED, YOU KNOW, RESOURCE GENERATION GOALS.

UM, WE HAVE, WE HAVE SOME LARGE GOALS.

78 MEGAWATT HUNDRED TWO MEGAWATT POWER PARTNER WILL ALONE WILL NOT GET US THERE.

SO BATTERIES ARE KEY, UM, WILL BE KEY, UM, DRIVERS FOR US TO ACHIEVE THE GOALS.

SO POINT WELL TAKEN, WE HAVE NOTED, BUT IT'S JUST, IT'S, WE'RE JUST STARTING IT AND WE WANT TO JUST LEARN ALL THOSE THINGS.

SO WE ARE A LITTLE BIT ON THE, ON THE CONSERVATIVE SIDE FOR A REASON.

IT IS A THERMOSTAT QUESTION.

UM, COMMISSIONER COOK.

HI.

THANKS Y'ALL.

THANK Y'ALL SO MUCH FOR THIS PRESENTATION.

REALLY EXCITING STUFF.

I JUST HAVE A QUICK QUESTION.

CAN Y'ALL TALK MORE ABOUT, UM, THE THERMOSTAT UPDATES? IS IT JUST, UM, THE $155 OR ARE THERE ANY ADDITIONAL CHANGES TO THE PROGRAM OR CAN YOU JUST TALK MORE ABOUT THAT? IT'S PRIMARILY THE INCENTIVE INCREASE, BUT WE'RE ALSO DOING A LOT MORE MARKETING THIS YEAR, SO WE'RE JUST DEVELOPING A MORE COMPREHENSIVE MARKETING CAMPAIGN.

UM, JUST BETTER HEADLINES TO GRAB ATTENTION, UPDATED MATERIALS IN THE STORES THROUGH OUR, UH, STRATEGIC PARTNERSHIP WITH, UM, THE, THE BRICK AND MORTAR SHOPS THAT WE PARTNER WITH.

UM, WE'RE ALSO DEVELOPING DIFFERENT STRATEGIES FOR HOW WE DEPLOY THE THERMOSTATS, UM, TO, TO, UM, SATISFY CUSTOMERS EXPECTATIONS MORE IN TERMS OF LIKE THE FREQUENCY OF OUR CALLED EVENTS.

SO THAT'S SOMETHING WE'RE WORKING ON AND BUILDING OFF OF LAST SUMMER, ACTUALLY, JUST TO ADD TO WHAT LINDSAY SAID, SO, UH, THOSE ARE THE FEW STRATEGIES WE ARE LOOKING AT.

WE HAVE IN, IN ADDITION TO THAT, VERY RECENTLY WE LAUNCHED A BUY NOW PORTAL.

SO THAT'S BASICALLY BY ENERGY EFFICIENCY OFFERING WHERE WE ARE TRYING TO MEET OUR CUSTOMERS, UH, WHERE THEY ARE IN TERMS OF E-COMMERCE EXPERIENCE.

SO BUY NOW PORTAL ALLOWS CUSTOMERS TO GO ONLINE, SELECT A THERMOSTAT WHICH IS ELIGIBLE, PURCHASE THE WHOLE THING, AND THEN GET IT SHIPPED.

SO THIS IS SOMETHING NEW FOR US.

WE ARE FURTHER LOOKING INTO THE NEXT ITERATION OF BUY NOW PORTAL WHERE WE ONLY ALLOW, OR WE, WE WE, WE, WE OFFER PRE-ENROLL DEMAND.

WE PRE-ENROLLED THERMOSTATS INTO OUR DEMAND RESPONSE PROGRAM.

SO WE HAVE, NOT ONLY THAT WE ARE, UH, UH, LOOKING AT DIFFERENT INTERVENTIONS, WE'RE ALSO PROVIDING SOME NEW CHANNELS FOR THE CUSTOMERS TO GET THE THERMOSTATS.

SO I, I ENCOURAGE YOU ALL TO GO TO BUY NOW PORTAL.

WE ARE VERY PROUD OF IT.

, UH, THAT'S GOOD TO HEAR.

UM, A A COUPLE THINGS.

ONE IS, UM, WHAT ARE CUSTOMERS SAYING ABOUT THE FREQUENCY? ARE THEY SAYING, I GUESS THEY'RE SAYING THEY WOULDN'T BE SAYING ANYTHING IF IT WAS NOT ENOUGH, BUT, SO I GUESS THAT ANSWERS THAT ACTUALLY.

BUT THE OTHER THING IS THAT, UM, HAVE Y'ALL CONSIDERED, IF I REMEMBER CORRECTLY, THE CURRENT PROGRAM, YOU CAN OPT IN OR YOU CAN LIKE OPT IN AND THEN YOU CAN, IF AE SENDS THE, THE SIGNAL TO UH, CUT, YOU KNOW, LOWER YOUR TEMPERATURE, RAISE IT, I GUESS, UH, THEY CAN JUST OPT OUT AND THEY'LL STILL GET THE YEARLY, HOWEVER, HOWEVER MUCH MONEY THAT IS, IS IS THAT UNDER CONSIDERATION FOR BEING CHANGED? WE ARE CONSIDERING CHANGING THAT WE ARE UNDER, UM, A FEASIBILITY STUDY RIGHT NOW WITH OUR VENDOR, UM, TO REALLY UNDERSTAND WHAT PAY FOR PERFORM.

I, I YEAH, YEAH, YEAH.

WE WOULD, WE WOULD CALL THAT PAY FOR PERFORMANCE, UM, WHERE WE WOULD SHIFT TO INSTEAD OF JUST PAYING FOR PARTICIPATION, JUST A BLANKET, YOU KNOW, 20 NOW $30 RECURRING INCENTIVE THAT YOU WOULD BE PAID BASED ON THE EVENTS YOU PARTICIPATE ON.

SO WE'RE, WE'RE LOOKING AT THAT VERY CLOSELY AND COMPARING WITH OTHER UTILITIES THAT DO THINGS LIKE THAT AND, AND JUST WORKING ON, UM, MESSAGING AND ENGAGEMENT AROUND IT, UM, IT KIND OF LINKS TO THIS CAMPAIGN THAT I SPEAK OF WHERE MARKETING'S REALLY TRYING TO TELL THE STORY OF THE POWER OF NUMBERS AND WHAT WE CAN DO AS A COMBINED, COMBINED INDIVIDUALS AS A, AS A COMMUNITY.

I SEE.

THAT MAKES SENSE.

THANKS.

UM, , COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ,

[00:45:01]

SO I, I THINK YOU MENTIONED YOU'RE WORKING ON, UH, INCREASING THE NUMBER I REMEMBER FROM A YEAR AGO WAS AROUND 2% OF ENROLLED CUSTOMERS.

I'M NOT SURE ON THE ACTUAL NUMBER.

UM, WHAT, WHAT, WHAT'S THE, WHAT FORM IS THAT TAKING? IS THAT MARKETING OR ARE WE GOING DOOR TO DOOR NOW OR HAS THE INCENTIVE, I DIDN'T TOTALLY UNDERSTAND THE 1 55.

HAS THE STRUCTURE OF THAT CHANGED? HAS THAT HAPPENING MORE IN THE FRONT END? BECAUSE COULD YOU TALK ABOUT THAT? YEAH, IT HAPPENS AT THE FRONT END.

SO ACROSS THE BOARD WE'VE INCREASED THE REBATE FOR THE DEVICE, WE'VE INCREASED THE ENROLLMENT INCENTIVE AND THE RECURRING INCENTIVE.

SO ALL THREE OF THOSE ELEMENTS HAVE GONE UP.

BUT IN TERMS OF MARKETING, WE'RE REALLY TRYING TO DO EVERYTHING WE CAN.

THERE'S, THERE'S, THERE'S, UH, HANGERS THAT WE LEAVE ON DOORS OF APARTMENT COMPLEXES THAT WE KNOW WE HAVE SMART AND WE HAVE INSTALLED SMART THERMOSTATS AT THOSE LOCATIONS.

UM, IT'S PRIMARILY THROUGH EMAIL.

'CAUSE THIS ENROLLMENT FOR THE PROGRAM IS HIGHLY, YOU KNOW, CLICK BASED TO, TO SIGN UP.

SO WE DO FOCUS A LOT ON EMAILS, UM, SOCIAL MEDIA, WE'VE, WE'VE PAID FOR ADVERTISEMENT SPACE.

I DON'T KNOW IF Y'ALL HEARD IT ON THE RADIO EARLIER THIS YEAR.

POWER PARTNERS WAS LISTED ON THE RADIO ADS IN THE MORNING.

UM, SO REALLY WE'RE, WE'RE TRYING TO DO EVERYTHING WE CAN AND LEANING ON VENDORS AND OUR OWN INTERNAL MARKETING TO DO THAT.

AND I'M JUST CURIOUS.

THAT SOUNDS, UH, UH, LIKE A REALLY, UH, COOL BIG STEP FORWARD.

I'M, I'M JUST WONDERING, I REMEMBER THERE WAS A, A LARGE UTILITY IN THE HOUSTON AREA THAT WAS SENDING CUSTOMERS THE SMART THERMOSTATS, SMART THERMOSTATS FOR, FOR FREE AND HAVING THE SORT OF LIKE A, A UTILITY REP COME IN AND INSTALL IT AND THEN THEY WOULD SORT OF BE, YOU KNOW, IT TAKES ALL OF THE STICKINESS OUTTA THAT PROCESS OF HAVING, YOU KNOW, HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF HOMES SET THESE THINGS UP WHEN THERE'S REALLY NO, YOU KNOW, IT SAVES A LITTLE BIT OF MONEY THAT THERE'S REALLY NO NEED FOR A HOME TO PUT ONE OF THESE THINGS IN IF SOMEONE'S NOT KIND OF NERDY ABOUT IT OR THINKING ABOUT THESE THINGS.

SO IS THAT SOMETHING THAT Y'ALL LOOKED AT OR RAN THE MATH ON AT ALL? YES, YES.

WE'VE TRIED THAT MODEL THROUGH OUR SMART HOME REWARDS PROGRAM AND, AND WE'RE LOOKING AT HOW WE CAN SCALE THAT FOR, FOR THIS SPECIFIC PRO PROGRAM.

WHAT IS THAT PROGRAM? THE SMART HOME REWARDS WAS THE ONE THAT WE, WE INSTALLED.

WE DIRECTLY INSTALLED, UM, THE SMART THERMOSTATS AND ASSISTED THE CUSTOMERS IN ENROLLING IN THE POWER PARTNER PROGRAM.

SO WAS THAT WITH THE CUSTOMER ASSISTANCE FOLKS OR THAT ARE GOING UNDERGOING ENERGY EFFICIENCY EQUIPMENTS OR SOMETHING OR, UM, IT, I'M NOT SURE.

IT'S WITH US IN ENERGY, IN ENERGY EFFICIENCY.

WE ACTUALLY, WE PARTNERED WITH DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY.

THERE WAS A GRANT FROM DOE, WHICH HELPED US, UM, RUN THIS PILOT AGAIN.

SO THE CONCEPT YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT IS DIRECT INSTALL.

THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT'S A GOOD CONCEPT.

VERY GOOD CONCEPT IN TERMS OF GETTING THE HIGHEST ISRS OR INSERVICE RATES.

AGAIN, THE ISSUE COMES DOWN TO, UM, YOU KNOW, OVERALL WE, WE HAVE SO MANY DIFFERENT OPPORTUNITIES AVAILABLE FOR CUSTOMERS.

UH, DIRECT INSTALLING IS SMART THERMOSTAT CAN BE A PRETTY, CAN HAVE A VERY LARGE PRICE TAG, IF YOU WILL.

RIGHT? YEAH.

SO WE ARE DOING OTHER INTERVENTIONS.

THAT'S WHERE WE ARE COMING IN WITH THE INCREASED INCENTIVES, ADDITIONAL INCENTIVES TO, TO INSTIGATE PEOPLE TO ENROLL AND STAY IN THE PROGRAMS. BUT JUST A SMART HOME REWARDS PROGRAM WAS THROUGH THE DEPARTMENT OF ENERGY GRANT WHERE WE HAVE INSTALLED WATER HEATER CONTROLLERS AND SMART THERMOSTATS IN ABOUT 1400 PROPERTIES, UH, 1400 MULTIFAMILY UNITS ACROSS FIVE BIG PROPERTIES.

AND NOW WE ARE IN THE PHASE OF ESTIMATING HOW THE, HOW THESE CUSTOMERS ARE PERFORMING OR HOW THE DEVICES ARE PERFORMING.

SO THAT'S ALL DONE BEHIND THE SCENES WITH THE, WITH THE HELP OF PROPERTY AND INSTALLATION.

SO THAT WILL TELL US A LOT ABOUT HOW DO WE GO FORWARD, UH, AND IN THIS MARKET AGAIN, THIS, THIS IS A DIFFICULT MARKET WITH, UH, WITH MULTIFAMILY, UH, UNITS AND INSTALLING EVERYTHING, DIRECT INSTALLING AND ALL THOSE THINGS.

SO, SO WE, WE ARE LEARNING THROUGH THE SMART HOME REWARDS.

COOL, THANK YOU.

AND THEN THE FINAL QUESTION IS JUST, I GUESS THERE ARE SOME, UH, WITH RESPECT TO THE, THE $75 A KILOWATT NUMBER, I, THERE ARE A FEW QUESTIONS ON THAT.

I WAS JUST WONDERING IF YOU MIGHT BE ABLE TO IN THE FUTURE PRESENT US, YOU KNOW, THE TRIANGULATION OF HOW YOU ARRIVED AT THAT OR WHAT THE CONSIDERATIONS WERE.

IT SEEMS LIKE WE DO SEEM TO BE REALLY INTERESTED IN THAT AND HOW IT KIND OF, YOU KNOW, THE UTILITY COMES UP WITH THIS STUFF AND I GUESS, YEAH, THERE'S SOME INTEREST IN MAKING THE NUMBER HIGHER IN THE FUTURE, BUT I THINK IT WOULD HELP US TO JUST UNDERSTAND WHERE IT'S COMING FROM, FROM THE UTILITIES PERSPECTIVE AND HOW THE SERVE UTILITY SEES ALL THAT IN TERMS OF THE FINANCES AND THAT DUALLY NOTED GENERALLY INCENTIVE STRATEGY IS NOT AN EXACT SCIENCE.

THERE IS SOME, SOME ART AND SOME SCIENCE.

WE HAVE, UM, DIFFERENT LIMITATIONS, BUT GENERALLY BECAUSE THIS IS A PILOT PROGRAM, WE ARE TAKING ADVICE FROM OUR PARTNER HERE, ENERGY HUB, WHO IS OUR VENDOR, UM, UH, AGGREGATOR HELPING US CONNECT WITH THE BATTERIES.

THEY ARE WORKING WITH MANY UTILITIES ACROSS THE COUNTRY, SIMILAR SIZE UTILITIES OR SIMILAR

[00:50:01]

JURISDICTION OR POLITICAL ENVIRONMENTS.

SO, SO THEIR GUIDANCE IS HELPING US LIKE, OKAY, YOU KNOW, HOW SIMILAR UTILITIES ARE GOING WITH THE PRICING, THEN OUR OWN INTERNAL, UM, UM, UH, CRITERIA.

SO AMONG THOSE THINGS THEY'RE GOING TO THIS, YOU KNOW, DECISION MAKING.

AND THEN WE HAVE A STARTING POINT, WHICH IS A $75 PER KW.

DO YOU WANT TO ADD SOMETHING? OH, I JUST WANTED TO ADD THAT WE HAVE TO NEGOTIATE WITH THE MANUFACTURERS OF THESE, THESE DEVICES SO THAT THAT WEIGHS INTO THE TRIANGULATION ALSO.

UM, VICE CHAIR ROBINSON, THEN COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, DO YOU WANNA GO FIRST, MARTIN? SURE, THANKS.

I WAS JUST CURIOUS, DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY HOUSEHOLDS HAVE, UH, BATTERY SYSTEMS IN THEM NOW? YEAH, AROUND 2000 WE THINK.

UM, YEAH, WE THINK THERE'S A LOT IN AUSTIN.

AND HOW MANY SOLAR PANEL SYSTEMS? I DO NOT KNOW THAT.

QUITE, QUITE A FEW MORE, QUITE MANY MORE.

I ONLY ASKED THAT 'CAUSE I JUST HAD A SOLAR PANEL SYSTEM INSTALLED ON MY, ON MY HOUSE, UH, IN UH, UH, DECEMBER.

AND UM, WHEN I WAS LOOKING AT THE COST OF, OF THE, THE BATTERY BACKUP SYSTEM, IT BASICALLY DOUBLED THE COST OF THE WHOLE SYSTEM.

UH, AND SO I, I CHOSE NOT TO GET THE BATTERY BECAUSE IT JUST, THE INCENTIVE WAS NOT THERE TO, TO SPEND TWICE AS MUCH MONEY TO HAVE THAT, UH, EE EVEN THOUGH IT'S VERY ATTE, YOU KNOW, YOU FEEL PRETTY GOOD ABOUT IT WHEN YOU HAVE THAT THERE.

UH, BUT I, I JUST COULDN'T DO IT.

AND IF THERE WERE GREATER INCENTIVES, I SURE WOULD HAVE, UH, THANK YOU.

WELL NOTED.

UH, COMMISSIONER, COMMISSIONER LUKI, UM, GOING FROM MEMORY, THERE'S PROBABLY AT LEAST 10,000 SOLAR SYSTEMS ON AUSTIN ENERGY'S GRID, UH, RESIDENTIAL SYSTEMS. UM, THAT'S A, A ROUGH NUMBER.

UH, CAN I GO, UH, I HAVE TWO QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS.

ONE, UM, I HAD HEARD SOMEWHERE THAT THERE WERE NEGOTIATIONS WITH, UH, COMPANY CALLED BASE POWER, UH, FOR A VIRTUAL POWER PLANT.

UH, IS THAT ALSO HAPPENING AND IF IT IS, HOW IS IT HAPPENING? UH, YES.

VICE CHAIR ROBBINS, UH, DEFINITELY I BELIEVE BASE POWER NEGOTIATIONS ARE ONGOING.

THAT'S FRONT OF THE METER, SO WE ARE SOMEWHAT OUTSIDE OF THAT DEPARTMENT.

WE CAN DEFINITELY TAKE THE QUESTION BACK, BUT MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT, AND MY BOSS CAN CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, THAT, UH, DEFINITELY BASED POWER DISCUSSIONS ARE HAPPENING.

YEAH, I I'D LIKE TO ADD THAT THIS, THIS PROGRAM WILL COMPLIMENT THAT PROGRAM.

UM, THIS COMPLIMENT, THIS PROGRAM WILL ALLOW THE CUSTOMER TO USE THE BATTERY THAT THEY OWN.

UM, THEY GET TO CHOOSE FROM A LIST OF MANUFACTURERS WITH THIS PROGRAM.

SO, UM, YEAH, I, I, I LOOK FORWARD TO THEM COMPLIMENTING EACH OTHER.

FEDERAL FACILITIES AND STATE FACILITIES.

THE OTHER, UH, QUESTION OR COMMENT I HAVE IS, IS THERE ANY STATUS AS TO THE FEDERAL GRANTS FOR SOLAR AND OR BATTERIES THAT HAVE BEEN AT LEAST TEMPORARILY BLOCKED? I BELIEVE THERE WAS A LAWSUIT BEING PURSUED IN ANOTHER COUNTY AND THAT THEY WERE WORKING ALSO ON OUR BEHALF.

IS THERE ANY UPDATE ON, UH, ON WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THAT TO GET THAT FEDERAL MONEY? UH, WE, WE WILL DEFINITELY TAKE THAT BACK.

I AM NOT AWARE OF ANY MOVEMENT.

I DO UNDERSTAND MY, MY UNDERSTANDING IS SAME AS YOU, UM, VICE CHAIR ROBBINS, THAT THERE IS A LAWSUIT AND SOME THINGS ARE BEING WORKED ON.

UH, BUT BEYOND THAT, I DON'T KNOW.

UM, SEVERAL QUESTIONS WITH RESPECT TO THE DEMAND RESPONSE PROGRAM.

HAVE YOU, ARE THE, THE PROBABLY THE BIGGEST ENERGY USERS IN OTHER THAN INDUSTRIAL CUSTOMERS ARE AND, AND AND DEMAND RESPONSE CANDIDATES WOULD BE UT AND THE STATE BUILDING, STATE CAPITAL COMPLEX? ARE YOU IN CONVERSATION ABOUT GETTING THEM ENROLLED? WE DID HAVE A PUSH TO, UM, PARTNER WITH ALL, UM, GOVERNMENT FACILITIES AFTER THE RESOLUTION TO ENROLL ALL CITY OF AUSTIN BUILDINGS.

SO YES, WE DID, WE DID ATTEMPT TO ENROLL THEM AND THERE ARE SOME FEDERAL BUILDINGS AND STATE BUILDINGS THAT ARE A PART OF OUR PROGRAM.

YOU WERE SAYING THAT IN THE PAST TENSE, DO WE INTERPRET THAT TO MEAN THEY WERE NOT INTERESTED IN SUPPORTING? WE DO THE RELIABILITY OF THE AREA THAT THEY ARE LOCATED IN.

WE DO HAVE SOME CUSTOMERS THAT ARE

[00:55:01]

ANYTHING IN THE CAPITAL COMPLEX, WE KEEP SHOWING THEM THE PHOTO OF THE ENTIRE CAPITAL COMPLEX LIT UP DURING YURI.

IT'S PRETTY EMBARRASSING.

I DON'T BELIEVE THE CAPITAL IS AMONG THEM.

I CAN DOUBLE CHECK THAT FOR YOU.

IT WOULD BE NICE TO TRY TO GET THAT MOVING.

ANYTHING IN THE COUNTY.

YES, WE DO HAVE A COUNTY BUILDING THAT IS ENROLLED ONLY ONE.

I I'LL HAVE TO GET BACK TO YOU ON THE COUNT.

IF MY BATTERY AND SOLAR WERE IN, UM, HOUSTON AND I COULD ACCESS, YOU KNOW, DAVE DAVID'S ENERGY OR SOME OF THOSE OTHER REPS, I WOULD NOT BE RECEIVING $30 PER SEASON.

IT, IT WOULD BE NICE IF THE COUNTY WAS A FULL SUPPORTER OF THAT.

UM, WHEN YOU DO A DEMAND RESPONSE EVENT, ARE YOU PITCHING THIS TO CUSTOMERS AS CURTAILMENT OR CYCLING OF THEIR LIST? CURTAILMENT IS CURTAILMENT NECESSARY.

IF YOU'RE RUNNING THE THERMOSTATS, IT'S EASIER TO KEEP CUSTOMERS LONGER IF YOU ARE CYCLING THEM ON AND OFF FOR HALF AN HOUR ON HALF AN HOUR OFF AND ROTATING IT ACROSS CUSTOMER GROUPS RATHER THAN SAYING, I'M GONNA CURTAIL YOU FOR FOUR HOURS WITHOUT AIR CONDITIONING.

YEAH, OUR, OUR UM, OUR INITIAL THERMOSTATS THAT WERE OFFERED THROUGH THE CYCLE SRS PROGRAM IN THE EARLY OTTS DID FUNCTION THROUGH CYCLING.

BUT THE MODERN SMART THERMOSTATS, THEY DON'T, THEY DON'T WORK THE SAME WAY.

SO I THINK IT WOULD BE INACCURATE TO DESCRIBE IT THAT WAY TO THE CUSTOMERS.

CAN DO THE CONTROL SIGNALS THAT YOU SEND THEM ALLOW CYCLING? I MEAN ISN'T THIS ABOUT WHAT YOU SET AS THE CONTROL PATTERN? NOT WHAT THE THERMOSTAT IS CAPABLE OF DOING? SO WE HAVE HANDFULS OF THESE DEVICES THAT ARE ELIGIBLE FOR THE PROGRAM.

AND SO EACH THERMOSTAT BEHAVES DIFFERENTLY WITH THE HVAC SYSTEM BASED ON THE CONFIGURATIONS OF THE HVAC SYSTEM AND ITS INSTALLATION AND HOW IT'S CONFIGURED WITH THE THERMOSTAT.

I CAN CHECK IF IT INCLUDES CYCLING, BUT I I DON'T BELIEVE THAT THAT IS, THAT SPECIFIC TACTIC IS, IS USED ANYMORE.

MY EXPERIENCE WITH DEMAND RESPONSE PROGRAMS HISTORICALLY IS THE CUSTOMERS ARE A LOT MORE WILLING TO PARTICIPATE IF IT'S A CYCLING RATHER THAN CURTAILMENT.

YEAH, WE, OUR, OUR RESIDENTIAL THERMOSTAT PROGRAM WORKS ON A SET POINT.

SO WE, WE RAISE IT BY THREE TO FOUR DEGREES TYPICALLY.

AND SO THEN THE, BASED ON THE ALGORITHMS BETWEEN THE THERMOSTAT AND THE HVAC, HOW THEY ARRIVE AT THAT TEMPERATURE, UM, IT VARIES ACROSS THE, THE PORTFOLIO FOR BOTH THE DEMAND RESPONSE PROGRAM AND THE BATTERY PROGRAM.

IT WAS NOT CLEAR TO ME FROM YOUR PRESENTATION WHETHER YOU ARE TRYING TO, WHETHER YOU ARE, WHETHER YOU ARE TRYING TO ONLY ENROLL BRAND NEW CUSTOMERS WITH BRAND NEW EQUIPMENT OR WHETHER YOU ARE WILLING TO SIGN UP FOLKS WHO ALREADY HAVE SMART THERMOSTATS AND ALREADY HAVE BATTERIES.

CAN YOU PLEASE CLARIFY? YEAH, GREAT QUESTION.

YEAH, WE, WE WANT EVERY ELIGIBLE THERMOSTAT AND BATTERY TO JOIN OUR PROGRAM.

SO WE DON'T HAVE THOSE LIMITS.

YOU CAN UM, YOU KNOW, ENROLL AT ONE TIME UNENROLL AND THEN COME BACK TO THE PROGRAM AND STILL BE ELIGIBLE FOR THE PARTICIPATION INCENTIVE FOR THE THERMOSTAT.

AND SAME THING FOR THE PERFORMANCE INCENTIVE FOR THE BATTERIES.

SO THERMOSTAT, IT'S PAY FOR PARTICIPATION AND WE WILL HONOR THAT AT ANY TIME.

IF YOU COME BACK TO OUR PROGRAM WITH YOUR THERMOSTAT, YOU ARE ELIGIBLE FOR THAT $30 A YEAR INCENTIVE.

AND WITH THE BATTERIES IT'S PAY FOR PERFORMANCE AND, AND YEAH, ANY ELIGIBLE BATTERY, NO MATTER THE INSTALLATION DATE, IF IT'S ELIGIBLE, WE WANT YOU IN THAT PERFORMANCE PORTION.

UM, WITH RESPECT TO ENROLLMENTS, ARE YOU, MOST OF THE FOLKS WHO HAVE BATTERIES, 40% OF NEW SOLAR INSTALLATIONS TODAY IN AUSTIN HAVE BATTERIES WITH THEM, HAVE A BATTERY INSTALLED AT THE SAME TIME YOU'RE IN THE 60%, WHICH IS FINE, BUT SO ARE, SO, SO SOLAR INSTALLERS ARE TRUSTED PARTNERS IN THIS.

ARE YOU WORKING WITH THEM TO MAKE THEM PARTNERS IN ENROLLMENT VERY CLOSELY? YES.

WE ARE PARTNERED WITH OUR OWN SOLAR INSPECTORS WHO ARE PARTNERED WITH THEIR INSTALLERS.

AND THESE INSTALLERS ARE INSTRUMENTAL IN GETTING THIS, UH, PROGRAM ENROLLMENT OUT TO THE CUSTOMERS AND INFORMING THEM OF INCLUDING PAST CUSTOMERS.

WE'RE GOING TO HAVE TO, I MEAN, CUSTOMERS WHO ALREADY HAVE INSTALLATIONS, RIGHT? WE'LL HAVE TO MARKET TO THEM OUTSIDE OF THE INSTALLER.

'CAUSE WE DON'T EXPECT THE INSTALLER TO, TO BE THERE NECESSARILY, BUT, WELL, THE INSTALLER HAS AN EXISTING RELATIONSHIP WITH THAT CUSTOMER.

YOU SHOULD TAKE ADVANTAGE OF IT.

WE SHOULD.

I'LL, I'LL MAKE NOTE OF THAT.

SO, UM, I'M, I'M NERVOUS OR OR QUESTIONING THE IDEA THAT YOU ARE ONLY THAT, THAT YOU PAY FOR LIKE PARTICIPATION IN THE PROGRAM AND YOU MIGHT PAY FOR PERFORMANCE.

BUT LET'S BE CLEAR THAT IF I WERE,

[01:00:01]

I COULD BE MAKING A HUNDRED DOLLARS IN A DAY WHEN, WHEN WE ARE IN A SIGNIFICANT EVENT AND ELECTRICITY PRICES ARE VERY HIGH.

I MEAN IT COULD BE PAYING FOR MY ENTIRE SOLAR SYSTEM IN A FEW YEARS.

IF, AND, AND AUSTIN IS IN AN, AN AREA WITH FAIRLY HIGH CONGESTION PRICES AND WE HEAR YOU WORRYING ABOUT VOLTAGE AND LOTS OF OTHER STUFF PRETTY FREQUENTLY AND ABOUT THE AMOUNT THAT SINCE WE ARE GENERATION SHORT, YOU ARE BUYING A LOT, I'D FEEL A LOT BETTER IF YOU WERE OFFERING TO ACCESS MY BATTERY FOR A PRICE THAT IS ANYWHERE CLOSE TO THE VALUE THAT YOU WOULD BE RECEIVING PER KILOWATT HOUR IN THE OPEN MARKET IF YOU WERE BUYING THE EQUIVALENT OF WHAT YOU COULD GET FROM MY BATTERY.

SO THE, IT SEEMS TO ME THAT WHAT YOU ARE OFFERING TO, TO BUY MY BATTERY AT IS CRIMINALLY SHORT OF WHAT IT'S WORTH TO YOU IN BOTH SUMMER AND WINTER EVENTS.

ESSAY QUESTION, ANSWER PLEASE.

, GO AHEAD.

SO I MADE A MENTAL NOTE.

WE'LL WRITE IT DOWN.

UH, THAT'S, UH, THE WAY, NOT EXACTLY ANSWERING, LET ME JUST COMMENT.

COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN ON THIS, THIS AGAIN, YOU KNOW, INCENTIVE STRATEGY IS NOT EXACT SCIENCE.

THERE'S SOME ART AND SCIENCE BASED UPON ALL THE DIFFERENT, DIFFERENT THINGS WE HAVE.

MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT WE DID WORK WITH OUR FINANCE AND RATES TEAM WHO LOOKED AT DIFFERENT, UH, SCENARIOS.

AND THE PRICE THAT WE HAVE SET IS WITHIN THE, WITHIN THE, WHAT'S THE RIGHT WORD, WITHIN, WITHIN THE ACCEPTABLE REALM OF WHAT THEY ARE USING IN TERMS OF CALCULATING PAYBACKS AND WHAT HAVE YOU.

BEYOND THAT, IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF A TECHNICAL, UH, JARGON IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, HOW THE PRICING, WHAT IS THE AVERAGE PRICE OVER THE 8 365 DAYS, UH, AND WHATNOT, A HUNDRED DOLLARS PER MEGAWATT MIGHT BE AT CERTAIN POINT, BUT THEN IT CAN BE 5,000 MEGAWATT DOLLARS PER MEGAWATT AT CERTAIN POINT.

SO $75.

BUT MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT OUR RATES AND OUR FINANCE TEAM WAS OKAY WITH IT IN TERMS OF WHAT THEY ARE WOULD CONSIDER AS A, AS A FAIR, FAIR PRICE TO OFFER AT THIS POINT.

AND, AND, AND WHAT I'M TRYING TO TELL YOU IS WHAT THEY CONSIDER TO BE A FAIR PRICE AND WHAT I CONSIDER TO BE A FAIR PRICE, ARE ABOUT THAT FAR APART.

AND THE REASON IS BECAUSE THEY'RE WORKING WITH AVERAGES AND WE ARE LOOKING AT, I AND PERHAPS OTHER BATTERY OWNERS ARE LOOKING AT THE VALUE OF THAT BATTERY WHEN ERCOT IS LOOKING AT VERY HIGH PRICES.

AND YOU NEED MY ENERGY THE MOST, WHICH IS DURING RAMPING PERIODS, FRANKLY, AND DURING DAYS LIKE YURI OR SUMMER PEAKS, WHEN ALL YOU NEED IS TWO HOURS OF MY BATTERY AND, AND 2000 OF, OR 4,000 OR 5,000 OF MY CLOSEST FRIENDS ON THEIR BATTERIES TO MATERIALLY REDUCE THE AMOUNT THAT YOU HAVE TO PAY IN THE OPEN MARKET.

SO THEY ARE, YOUR FRIENDS IN THE FINANCE DEPARTMENT ARE WORKING ON AVERAGES.

YEP.

AND I'M WORKING ON WHAT I CAN SEE ON THE ERCOT OR THE GRID STATUS IO WEBPAGE IN TERMS OF THE REAL TIME VALUE OF EVERY KILOWATT HOUR IN MY BATTERIES.

SO I SUGGEST THAT YOU GO BACK TO THEM WITH SOME KIND OF PROPOSITION THAT SAYS, WHEN THE WHOLESALE PRICE OF ELECTRICITY AT PER KILOWATT HOUR IS HIGHER THAN THIS, WE SHOULD BE PAYING PEOPLE SIGNIFICANTLY MORE FOR THEIR BATTERIES.

SO YOU NEED TO PAY US SOME KIND OF BASE RATE THAT IS LIKE, UM, YOU KNOW, SECURE OUR PARTICIPATION AND FRIENDSHIP AND THEN A RATE FOR PARTICULAR EVENTS THAT ACTUALLY REFLECTS THE TRUE VALUE OF IT IN THE OPEN MARKET AND THE AMOUNT THAT YOU ARE ACTUALLY SAVING.

IT DOESN'T HAVE, YOU DON'T HAVE TO PAY ME THE FULL PRICE OF, OF ERCOT WHOLESALE PRICE, BUT YOU SHOULD PAY ENOUGH TO KNOW THAT TO LET ME KNOW THAT YOU KNOW, THAT IT'S WORTH A HELL OF A LOT MORE THAN $30 PER YEAR PER KILOWATT.

SO JUST TO, I WANNA PIGGYBACK ON THAT.

I THINK, AGAIN, LIKE AUSTIN HAS ALL THESE LOFTY GOALS, RIGHT? RIGHT NOW, AUSTIN ENERGY IS LITERALLY IN THE WAY OF THOSE GOALS, RIGHT? LIKE THE OPEN MARKET EIGHT YEAR PAYBACK FOR A BATTERY AUSTIN, CURRENTLY INFINITE PAYBACK FOR A BATTERY, YOUR PROGRAM 45 YEAR PAYBACK FOR A BATTERY, RIGHT? LIKE THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

SO I THINK YOU CAN THINK ABOUT IT LIKE IN TERMS OF THE VALUE OF THE GRID AND HOW YOU'RE PAYING, PAYING IT DOWN, BUT IT'S LIKE, UNLESS YOU GUYS ARE BEATING THE DEREGULATED MARKET, THEN WE'RE NOT LIKE, WHAT IS THE POINT OF AUSTIN ENERGY, RIGHT? LIKE, AS AN ENTITY THAT

[01:05:01]

IS MUNICIPALLY OWNED AND OPERATED WITH, UH, STATED GOALS AND, YOU KNOW, LIKE THE PURVIEW OF THE CLIMATE ACTION PLAN, RIGHT? SO AS A CONSUMER, WE'RE NOT GONNA BUY A BATTERY IF IT DOESN'T PAY ITSELF OFF EVER.

SOME PEOPLE MIGHT PAY IT OFF IN 45 YEARS.

IF YOU CAN PAY IT OFF IN SIX YEARS, IMAGINE HOW MANY BATTERIES ARE GONNA GET INSTALLED IN THE CITY AND HOW MUCH WORK THAT'S GONNA DO, AND HOW MUCH THAT'S GONNA BRING RATES DOWN FOR PEOPLE.

UM, I I THINK I WANTED TO ASK ABOUT THE EV PROGRAM.

LIKE I THINK YOU GUYS TOUCHED ON THAT, BUT I'M JUST CURIOUS ABOUT LIKE A LITTLE MORE DETAIL.

AND ALSO WE DON'T HAVE REALLY ANYTHING ELSE IN THE AGENDA, AND WE'RE ALL LIKE, REALLY ABOUT, LIKE, EXCITED ABOUT THIS STUFF.

SO APPRECIATE YOU GUYS KIND OF STANDING FOR A LONG TIME.

WE DO HAVE, UM, WE DO, WE DO HAVE THINGS FOLLOWING THIS IS WE ACTUALLY HAVE AN ITEM THAT WE MAY VOTE ON.

OH, I'M SORRY.

I THOUGHT IT WAS JUST A DISCUSSION, BUT THIS IS IMPORTANT.

YEAH, IT'S OKAY.

WELL, I STILL WANNA KNOW ABOUT THE EV RATE.

DO YOU HAVE A SPECIFIC QUESTION OR JUST LIKE, HOW DOES IT, YOU KNOW, LIKE I I I HAVEN'T HEARD OF IT.

THERE'S LIKE 65,000 EVS IN AUSTIN.

LIKE HOW MANY OF THOSE ARE ON IT? LIKE HOW DO WE, HOW DOES YEAH.

WE HAVE ABOUT 1200 ENROLLED ON OUR POWER PARTNER EV PROGRAM.

SO HOW DO WE GET THAT CLOSER TO 65,000? RIGHT NOW WE'RE LOOKING AT MARKETING TO OUR EXISTING CUSTOMERS THAT TOOK ADVANTAGE OF THE REBATE FOR THE CHARGING STATIONS THAT WE AWARD.

AND SOON WE'RE GOING TO MAKE IT REQUIRED TO GET THAT REBATE.

YOU MUST ENROLL IN POWER PARTNER EV.

AND WHAT, AND I GUESS COULD YOU JUST TALK LIKE WHAT DOES IT DO? HOW DOES IT WORK? YEAH, SO POWER PARTNER EV, IT'S A MANAGED CHARGING PROGRAM.

IT'S, UM, DRIVEN BY SIMILAR STRATEGY, SIMILAR DISPATCH STRATEGY AS OUR THERMOSTAT PROGRAM.

WE'RE, WE'RE REALLY GOING AFTER THAT FOUR CP AND WHOLESALE MARKET PRICING.

UM, WE DISPATCH NO MORE THAN 15 TIMES A MONTH WITH THAT PROGRAM.

UM, WE CAN EN WE CAN ENROLL CHARGING STATIONS ELIGIBLE, ELIGIBLE CHARGING STATIONS.

SMART.

THEY HAVE TO BE SMART TWO-WAY COMMUNICATING CHARGING STATIONS.

AND WE ALSO HAVE THE ABILITY TO ONBOARD TESLAS AND GM DIRECTLY THROUGH THEIR VEHICLE.

SO THEY COULD USE ANY CHARGING STATION THEY WANT TO ENROLL IN THAT PROGRAM.

UM, THE PROGRAM WILL EITHER SLOW THE CHARGING OR DELAY IT, UM, BASED ON THE SPECIFIC MANUFACTURER THAT THEY WORK WITH.

IT KIND OF VARIES.

UM, AS WITH A LOT OF OUR DEMAND RESPONSE DEVICES, IT, WE, WE HAVE TO KIND OF STAY WITHIN WHAT THE MANUFACTURER WANTS.

SO THAT'S WHY WE GET LIKE A VARIETY OF, OF CHARACTERISTICS THROUGHOUT THE PROGRAM.

UM, WE, WE GET A LOT OF GOOD FEEDBACK.

PEOPLE, PEOPLE LIKE THE PROGRAM, UM, YOU KNOW, THEY CAN, THEY CAN TELL WHEN WE'RE, UM, DISPATCHING THEIR, THEIR VEHICLE BASED ON LIKE A LIGHT THAT GOES OFF ON THEIR APP OR ON THE CHARGING STATION.

AND IT'S RELATIVELY EASY FOR THE CUSTOMER TO OVERRIDE IT IF THEY'RE, YOU KNOW, PLANNING TO DRIVE OUT THAT NIGHT AND REALLY WANT A FULL CHARGE.

UM, THEY, THEY CAN DO THAT WITHOUT PENALTY.

UM, THEY REALLY LIKE THAT THEY CAN PLUG IN WHEN THEY GET HOME AND NOT HAVE TO, UM, CONSIDER, YOU KNOW, THE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACTS.

LIKE THEY CAN RELY ON AUSTIN ENERGY TO DISPATCH THAT PROGRAM WHEN, WHEN WE NEED TO.

UM, SO YEAH, YOU CAN PLUG IN THE CAR AND IF WE NEED TO DELAY THE CHARGE, YOUR CAR STAYS PLUGGED IN AND THE CHARGE JUST DELAYS BY SEVERAL HOURS.

OKAY, GREAT.

I THINK HIGH LEVEL TOO, I THINK A LOT OF THIS STUFF FEELS LIKE VIRTUAL POWER PLANTS I KNOW ARE KIND OF LIKE COMING UNDER SCRUTINY NOW AND IT'S JUST LIKE TIME OF USE, RIGHT? IT'S LET THE MARKET DECIDE.

AND SO A LOT OF THIS STUFF IS, IT'S LIKE IT PUTS A LOT OF ONUS ON YOU GUYS TO DEVELOP THESE PROGRAMS AND THEN BE CONSTANTLY TWEAKING THEM BASED ON MARKET AND DO ALL OF THIS MARKETING.

IT SEEMS LIKE MAYBE A BLUNTER INSTRUMENT IS GONNA BE MORE EFFECTIVE WHERE IT'S JUST LIKE YOU GOT TIME OF USE AND PEOPLE CHARGE WHEN IT'S CHEAP AND THEY DON'T CHARGE WHEN IT'S EXPENSIVE.

AND APARTMENT OWNERS DEAL WITH THAT IN ONE WAY AND HOMEOWNERS DEAL WITH ANOTHER WAY, AND THEN IT'S LIKE, I DON'T KNOW, IT SEEMS LIKE IT CAN GET FINICKY AND MAYBE THAT'S SOMETHING TO CONSIDER.

WE SEE A LOT OF UTILITIES OFFERING BOTH, SO THEY'LL HAVE A TIME OF USE PROGRAM AND THEN ON TOP OF IT, A MORE DISPATCH STYLE, UM, PROGRAM ON TOP OF IT.

HERE AS WELL, OEMS, WHETHER OEMS WANTS TO OPEN UP THEIR BLACK BOXES OR NOT.

COOL.

WELL, IT'D BE INTERESTING TO SEE HOW, THE GOOD THING IS THAT OUR PROGRAMS, THE WAY WE ARE, WE HAVE DESIGNED THEM AND WE ARE EVOLVING THEM.

WE HAVE PUT THEM IN THE MARKETPLACE, THEY CAN RESPOND TO ANY PRICING STRUCTURE.

WE'RE A LITTLE BIT, UM, TIME OF TO DISCUSS TIME OF USE.

RACE IS A LITTLE BIT BEYOND OUR EXPERTISE, BUT THE PROGRAM, THE PROGRAMS, THE WAY THEY'RE DESIGNED, THEY CAN RESPOND TO ANY DATA STRUCTURE OUT THERE.

NOW WE ARE DESIGNING THE PROGRAMS, WE ARE DOING THE MARKETING.

WE ARE CONVINCING PEOPLE TO COME INTO PROGRAM.

BUT THEN THERE IS ANOTHER ASPECT

[01:10:01]

SO WE, THAT'S WHY WE WERE VERY EXCITED WHEN GM OPENED UP TO US, UH, WITH, WITH OUR VENDOR.

SO IT'S AN INDUSTRYWIDE THING AND A LOT OF DIFFERENT PLAYERS HAVE TO COME TOGETHER, BUT WE ARE MAKING EVERY EFFORT WE CAN, UH, AS IT'S IN OUR BEST INTEREST TO HAVE AS MANY EV EV UH, DRIVERS ENROLLED.

I, MYSELF AN EV DRIVER AND I LIVE IN A CONDO, SO I WANT TO HAVE SOMETHING WHERE MY FORD CAN TALK DIRECTLY TO OUR PROGRAM WITHOUT HAVING A CHARGER.

UH, I ONLY WANTED TO MAKE A SUGGESTION TO COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN.

UH, MAYBE YOU WANT TO CONSIDER FORMALIZING YOUR SUGGESTION IN THE FORM OF A RESOLUTION.

, THANK YOU.

IF THAT'S A GOOD SUGGESTION, I WILL BE HAPPY TO HAVE A CONVERSATION WITH AUSTIN ENERGY STAFF TO SEE WHETHER WE NEED TO DO BRUTE FORCE WITH RESOLUTION OR WHETHER, HOW MUCH PROGRESS WE CAN MAKE THROUGH CONVERSATION FIRST.

BUT THANK YOU FOR THE SUGGESTION.

UH, AND UH, I, I DO WANT TO THANK THE TWO OF YOU FOR, UH, BRINGING THIS TO US.

UM, I HAVE A REPUTATION FOR NEVER BEING HAPPY ABOUT ANYTHING, AND I, I AM ACTUALLY, UH, HAPPY TO SEE SOME PROGRESS.

YOU'RE VERY WELCOME.

KEEP US HONEST.

WE, WE, WE ARE ALL VERY HAPPY TO SEE THIS COMING TO FRUITION AND, AND MY COMMENTS, AND I'M SURE OTHERS ARE INTENDED TO MAKE IT EVEN BETTER NOT TO SAY DON'T DO, DON'T DO IT.

SO THANK YOU.

THANK YOU, THANK YOU.

ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? I HAVE A COUPLE.

ACTUALLY, SURE.

UM, WITH THE DEMAND RESPONSE, UM, UH, WITH THE THERMOS, THE SMART THERMOSTAT PROGRAM, THE ANNUAL INCENTIVE TO STAY ENROLLED IN THE PROGRAM, $30, $35, SOMETHING LIKE THAT, IT'S NOW $30.

WHEN DO THE PARTICIPANTS RECEIVE THAT AND HOW DO THEY RECEIVE IT AND HOW DO THEY KNOW? SO THEY, THEY RECEIVE IT ON THE ANNIVERSARY OF THEIR ENROLLMENT.

IT COMES IN THE FORM OF A BILL CREDIT AND THEY GET A, A, AN EMAIL THAT THE REBATE SYSTEM GENERATES UPON IT, ITS POSTING TO THE BILL.

MM-HMM .

AND DO YOU HAPPEN TO KNOW, LIKE SEASONALLY WHEN THESE TEND TO HAPPEN? I WOULD IMAGINE AROUND SUMMER IS WHEN THEY, A LOT OF TIMES THEY GET INSTALLED.

WE DO GET MORE ENROLLMENTS DURING THE SUMMER MM-HMM .

SO THE, WHEN YOUR BILL IS GONNA BE HIGHER ANYWAY AND YOU'RE LESS LIKELY TO NOTICE A $30 CREDIT MAYBE, PERHAPS.

BUT YEAH, WE DO IT, IT, IT ISSUES ON THE ANNIVERSARY YEAR, SO MM-HMM .

UM, YEAH, THAT'S SOMETHING I THINK, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT MARKETING AND GETTING PEOPLE, UH, YOU KNOW, EXCITED ABOUT IT.

UH, I, I REALLY LIKED, UH, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN'S COMMENT ABOUT CYCLING.

MM-HMM .

UH, ANOTHER QUESTION IS, IT SEEMS, IT SEEMS LIKE THE, THE, THE TEMPERATURES INCREASED, THERE'S PRECOOLING AND THEN THIS RAISED THREE TO FOUR DEGREES, AND DOES A PERSON WHO, A PARTICIPANT WHO KEEPS THEIR THERMOSTAT AT 72 GO UP THREE DEGREES AND A PERSON WHO KEEPS THEIR THERMOSTAT AT 78 ALSO GO UP THREE DEGREES? YES.

MY THERMOSTAT GOES UP TO ABOVE 80 WHEN THAT HAPPENS.

SAME.

AND THAT'S REALLY NOT TOLERABLE.

AND SO AS A, AS A PARTICIPANT WHO'S TRYING TO DO THE RIGHT THING, TRYING TO CONSERVE, TRYING TO SAVE MONEY BY KEEPING THE THERMOSTAT PRETTY HIGH, GENERALLY, UM, I CAN'T TOLERATE 82, 82, 83.

SO IT SEEMS LIKE THE PROGRAM MIGHT BENEFIT FROM BEING A LITTLE BIT SMARTER ABOUT THAT.

LIKE, MAYBE THE PEOPLE WHO ARE ALREADY UP AT 70, 70, 78, 79, THEY ONLY GO UP A DEGREE OR TWO, OR MAYBE THEY CYCLE.

UM, WHEREAS THE PEOPLE THAT KEEP THEIR THERMOSTAT AT 70, YOU KNOW, OKAY, LET'S GO UP FIVE DEGREES, MAYBE, YOU KNOW, SOMETHING LIKE THAT.

I, I THINK THAT THERE'S ROOM TO MAKE THINGS MORE INTELLIGENT AND MORE, UM, EFFICIENT AND, AND THAT SORT OF THING.

YEAH, SO THAT'S A COMFORT QUESTION.

I THINK WE GET, UM, TO MYOPIC AND LOOKING AT THE RESOURCE SAVING, THE MEGAWATT SAVING.

SO WHAT, UM, COMMISSIONER DAVID, YOU SAID IS, IS A VERY MUCH A COMFORT, A COMFORT ITEM, AND HOW DO WE, WE BRING COMFORT INTO THESE ALGORITHMS AND EQUATIONS? THAT, THAT'S A GOOD POINT.

WE'LL DEFINITELY GET BACK AND, UM, AND THEN WORK WITH OUR VENDORS.

MONTH WHEN IT'S LIKELY TO, YOU KNOW, BE NOTICED MORE.

AND THEN, YOU KNOW, WAYS TO ALSO LIKE, LET PEOPLE KNOW THAT THEY'RE, THEY ARE GETTING THIS BENEFIT.

UM, I, I ENROLLED A FEW YEARS AGO, I NEVER KNOW THAT I, I NEVER NOTICE, UH, A BILL CREDIT ABOUT IT.

SO, UM, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD DO IT IN A, A DIFFERENT

[01:15:01]

YOU KNOW, THINK OF WAYS TO MAKE IT MORE NOTICEABLE YEAH.

THAT PEOPLE ARE PARTICIPATING.

THAT'S A GOOD SUGGESTION.

APPRECIATE THE PRESENTATION, TIMING.

ALRIGHT.

YOU'RE WELCOME.

YOU'RE RIGHT.

THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME.

AWESOME.

WE'RE GONNA MOVE NOW TO DISCUSSION ACTION ITEM NUMBER TWO, WHICH IS DISCUSSION AND RECOMMEND RESIDENTIAL ELECTRIC RATES IMPLEMENTED BY AUSTIN ENERGY AND ITS EFFECTS ON ENERGY CONSERVATION AND EQUITY.

UM, THAT'S THE STAFF BRIEFINGS.

UM,

[2. Discussion and recommend residential electric rates implemented by Austin Energy and its effects on energy conservation and equity.]

MR. VICE CHAIR, TAKE IT AWAY.

UH, COMMISSIONERS, UH, PLEASE REFER TO THE REVISED VERSION THAT'S IN YOUR PACKET, NOT THE ORIGINAL, THAT'S THE ONE THAT IS UPDATED.

IT, UH, HAS INPUT FROM THREE OTHER COMMISSIONERS.

UH, MR. VICE CHAIR IS, IS THIS RECOMMENDATION THAT YOU'RE REFERRING TO, IS THAT, IS THAT POSTED OR DOES DAVID HAVE IT TO BE ABLE TO BRING IT UP ON THE SCREEN? UM, WELL, THERE'S TWO THINGS HE WOULD WANT TO BRING UP ON THE SCREEN.

THERE'S A SHORT PRESENTATION THAT I HAVE.

AND THEN THERE'S THE RESOLUTION ITSELF.

SO WE START WITH THE PRESENTATION.

UH, THIS IS A SLIDE FROM A PRESENTATION MADE BY AUSTIN ENERGY DURING ITS RATE INCREASE PROPOSAL IN 2022 DURING THE 2022 RATE CASE.

UH, THIS IS TIME FOR ABOUT FOUR MINUTES.

UM, UH, COMMISSIONERS, UH, THIS IS A SHORT PRESENTATION HIGHLIGHTING SOME OF THE MAIN POINTS OF THE RESOLUTION TO CHANGE AUSTIN ENERGY'S RESIDENTIAL RATES INTO SOMETHING MORE PROGRESSIVE SLIDE.

UH, AUSTIN ENERGY HAS MADE A STATEMENT THAT ITS CUSTOMER CHARGE IS NOT HIGH COMPARED TO NEIGHBORING UTILITIES.

SO IT'S INSTRUCTIVE TO SEE WHAT OTHER LARGE MUNICIPAL UTILITIES IN TEXAS ARE CHARGING.

AND AS YOU CAN SEE, ALL THESE, UH, LARGER, UH, TEXAS MUNICIPAL UTILITIES ARE CHARGING LESS THAN AUSTIN ENERGY, PARTICULARLY, UH, I'LL NOTE SAN ANTONIO, THE LAR, ONE OF THE LARGEST MUNICIPAL UTILITIES IN THE COUNTRY WITH A CUSTOMER CHARGE OF $9 50 CENTS.

UH, SLIDE AUSTIN ENERGY HAS TRIED TO JUSTIFY THE, UH, BILL INCREASE, UH, THE RATE INCREASE BY SAYING THE POOR ARE TAKEN CARE OF THROUGH THE CUSTOMER ASSISTANCE PROGRAM DISCOUNT, BUT CUSTOMER ASSISTANCE OR CAP, AS IT'S COMMONLY KNOWN, SERVES LESS THAN A THIRD OF RESIDENTIAL CUSTOMERS WHO ARE LOW OR MODERATE INCOME.

MOST OF THE POOR REALLY ARE NOT COVERED BY IT SLIDE.

NOW, HERE'S A MAP I SHOWED YOU AT THE LAST MEETING THAT DEFINES HOW MUCH RATES HAVE INCREASED BETWEEN 22 AND 2026, UH, EXCUSE ME, BETWEEN 2022 AND 2026 BY COUNCIL DISTRICT.

UH, SLIDE.

UH, THE RESOLUTION STATES THAT AUSTIN ENERGY HAS NOT INFORMED CITY COUNCIL OR THE PUBLIC OF THIS.

AND IN CASE YOU ARE WONDERING WHY I STATE THIS AS FACT, IT'S BECAUSE AUSTIN ENERGY TOLD ME THIS IN AN ANSWER TO A PUBLIC INFORMATION REQUEST I MADE TO THE UTILITIES GENERAL MANAGER LAST DECEMBER.

UH, DO NOTE THE, UH, RED RESPONSE AT THE BOTTOM, UH, TO THE QUESTION, UH, HAVE YOU INFORMED COUNSEL, THE GENERAL PUBLIC OF, UH, HOW THE DISTRICTS, VARIOUS DISTRICTS ARE AFFECTED NO RESPONSIVE INFORMATION, WHICH BASICALLY MEANS THEY DIDN'T DO IT.

SLIDE, UH, AUSTIN ENERGY HAS STATED IN A PRESENTATION LAST SUMMER THAT EVEN THOUGH RATES WENT UP, FUEL COSTS WENT DOWN.

SO OVERALL ELECTRIC BILLS WENT DOWN, HOWEVER, THEY USED OXYGEN ENERGY USED THE WRONG FUEL COST TO CALCULATE THIS.

NOW, HERE'S A PRESENTATION THAT THEY MADE, UH, IN THE SUMMER OF LAST YEAR STATING FUEL COST OF 5.30 CENTS SLIDE.

AND HERE IS AN EMAIL FROM JANUARY 9TH FROM AUSTIN ENERGY, UH, SHOWING A FUEL COST OF ABOUT 4.30 CENTS.

SO OVERALL BILLS IN 2026 REALLY ARE HIGHER THAN THE YEAR BEFORE SLIDE.

UH, FINALLY, AND PERHAPS MOST IMPORTANTLY, AUSTIN ENERGY HAS CLAIMED AS RECENTLY AS LAST FRIDAY, THAT IT HAS PROGRESSIVELY TIERED A PROGRESSIVELY TIERED RATE STRUCTURE.

SO IT IS INSTRUCTIVE TO LOOK HOW THE UTILITY TRIED TO ALL BUT ELIMINATE IT.

SLIDE.

[01:20:02]

THE LEFT CIRCLE IN GREEN, YOU'LL, UH, IT HAS A DIFFERENTIAL OF 8 CENTS A KILOWATT HOUR BETWEEN THE LOWEST AND HIGHEST TIER FOR THE EXISTING 2022 RATE.

BUT IN THE RIGHT CIRCLE CIRCLED RED, YOU SEE AUSTIN ENERGY'S PROPOSAL TO REDUCE THE DIFFERENTIAL TO ONLY 1 CENT PER KILOWATT HOUR BETWEEN THE LOWEST AND HIGHEST TIER.

AUSTIN ENERGY'S CONTINUED TO TAX, HAVE IN FACT REDUCED THE DIFFERENTIAL BETWEEN THE LOWEST AND HIGHEST TIERS TO 6 CENTS PER KILOWATT HOUR BY 2026.

AND THIS NEEDS TO BE REVERSED.

SLIDE.

UH, AND WITH THAT, I THANK YOU AND WE'LL TAKE QUESTIONS OR COMMENTS.

ALSO, I, I REALIZE A LOT OF YOU, UH, MAY NOT HAVE SEEN THIS CITY.

EMAILS ARE REALLY HARD FOR SOME PEOPLE TO ACCESS, INCLUDING ME, BUT I DID EMAIL A POINT BY POINT, UH, ON THE, WHEREAS IS, UH, EARLIER TODAY, UH, TRYING TO EXPLAIN THE DOCUMENTATION OR SUPPOSITIONS THAT I MADE WHEN CRAFTING THIS RESOLUTION.

THANK YOU, MR. VICE CHAIR.

UH, ARE THERE QUESTIONS FOR THE VICE CHAIR ON THIS? YES.

COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, I DON'T EVER WANNA GET IN A FIGHT WITH VICE-CHAIR BINS OVER NUMBERS A B UM, HIS NUMBERS CLEARLY SHOWED THAT AUSTIN ENERGY RATES FOR, FOR LOWER INCOME AT THE LOWEST CONSUMPTION TIER HAVE GONE UP, NOT DOWN AS, AND, AND THERE WERE A COUPLE OF SILLY STATEMENTS IN THE AUSTIN ENERGY MEMORANDUM OF FEBRUARY 13, BUT THE SILLIEST ONE WAS, BASE RATES ARE APPLIED CONSISTENTLY TO AUSTIN ENERGY CUSTOMERS IN ANY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN, AMONG CUSTOMER BILLS IS DUE TO CONSUMPTION PATTERNS, NOT COUNCIL DISTRICT.

THAT IS TRUE.

BUT, UM, USE PATTERNS REFLECT INCOME AND POPULATION LOCATION PATTERNS AND THIS, AND THOSE ARE REFLECTED IN COUNCIL DISTRICTS, WHICH IS SOMETHING THAT OUR COUNCIL MEMBERS SHOULD CARE VERY DEEPLY ABOUT.

THANK YOU, COMMISSIONER KENARD? UH, I HAVE A SUPER QUICK COMMENT JUST ABOUT THE SORT OF COUNTERACTING INCENTIVES IN TERMS OF THE INCREASE IN, IN THE BASE RATE WITH WHAT WE ON THE COMMISSION ARE TRYING TO DO, WHICH IS IMPROVE ENERGY EFFICIENCY, UH, IN SORT OF FUNDAMENTAL WAY.

AND I COULD IMAGINE A SITUATION WHERE IF YOU ARE A HIGHER INCOME CUSTOMER AND YOU HAVE A LOT OF ROOF SPACE THAT YOU ARE NOT USING FOR A SOLAR SYSTEM, BEING IN A SITUATION WHERE YOU HAVE A HIGH BASE RATE, DISINCENTIVIZES YOU TO MAKE THAT, THAT CHOICE.

IF WE HAD A MORE PROGRESSIVE STRUCTURE, AND IF YOU HAVE A VERY LARGE HOUSE AND YOU GET UP INTO THE REALLY HIGH USAGE OF ELECTRICITY, THEN SUDDENLY THE PAYBACK TIME FOR A SOLAR SYSTEM COMES DOWN.

IF YOU HAVE A MORE PROGRESSIVE RATE, THE STRUCTURE IS NOW DISINCENTIVIZES.

THAT KIND OF BEHAVIOR AND STRIKES ME AS A SORT OF, YOU KNOW, SUBOPTIMAL WAY FORWARD.

UM, I, I JUST WANNA COMMENT THAT OUR, THE, THE CURRENT TIERS, THERE'S, THERE'S FOUR TIERS NOW, SO NOT THE THREE THAT WERE PROPOSED IN THE, IN THE RATE CASE IN 2022, THAT WAS THE PROPOSAL, BUT WHAT WE THEY NETTED OUT WAS, WAS FOUR DOWN FROM FIVE.

UH, YOU'RE AB YOU'RE ABSOLUTELY CORRECT.

UH, I DID NOT SHOW THAT SLIDE AS THE LAST WORD I SHOWED THAT SLIDE AS INTENT.

I'M BASICALLY, I HAVE WATCHED AUSTIN ENERGY TRY AND MAKE THE RATES MORE PROGRESSIVE, EXCUSE ME, REGRESSIVE SINCE THE RATE CASE IN 2012 FOR THAT MATTER.

I'VE WATCHED AUSTIN ENERGY FIGHT THE FIRST PROGRESSIVE RATE STRUCTURE THAT AUSTIN HAD IN 1981.

THEY JUST, THE UTILITY JUST DOESN'T LIKE THIS KIND OF RATE STRUCTURE.

I DON'T THINK THERE'S ANYBODY IN, IN THIS ROOM THAT WAS HERE IN, BESIDES YOURSELF THAT WAS FROM THE UTILITY THAT WAS HERE IN 1981.

UM, BUT I I, I DID

[01:25:01]

ACTUALLY HAVE ANOTHER QUESTION ABOUT YOUR, YOUR PRESENTATION.

WHEN YOU HAD THE PERCENTAGE OF LOW INCOME CUSTOMERS, I THINK IT WAS 14% THAT WERE IN CAP AND THEN 33% LOW INCOME, BUT NOT IN CAP.

WHAT'S THE SOURCE OF THAT DATA? I'M SORRY, I, I I SHOULD HAVE BEEN CLEAR.

THE, THE, I DID CITE ONE SOURCE.

I DID CITE ONE SOURCE, WHICH IS, UH, THE 14% COMES FROM DATA THAT AUSTIN ENERGY PROVIDED THAT I SENT TO THE ENTIRE COMMISSION.

IT'S A MULTI-TAP SPREADSHEET WITH ALL THE DISTRICTS AND IT SUMMARIZES 'EM, AND THERE'S A KEY, BUT THAT'S WHERE THE 14% COMES FROM.

THE 47%, THE 33% OVER THE 14% COMES FROM THE CITY DEMOGRAPHER'S OFFICE.

UH, EVERY YEAR, UH, SHE UPDATES EACH COUNCIL DISTRICT FOR THEIR DEMOGRAPHICS.

AND ONE OF THE METRICS IS PERCENT OF LOW AND MODERATE INCOME RESIDENTS IN THAT DISTRICT.

FORGIVE ME FOR NOT PUTTING THAT IN WHAT I SENT YOU THIS MORNING.

NO, NO, THANKS FOR DOING THAT.

THAT'S HELPFUL.

SO I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE I'M UNDERSTANDING IT PROPERLY.

SO THE, THE 47% IS THE PERCENTAGE OF AUSTIN RESIDENTIAL HOUSEHOLDS THAT ARE CONSIDERED LOW AND MODERATE INCOME? YES.

AND TO BE AND WHAT IS THE, WHAT IS THE ACTUAL INCOME LEVEL THAT, THAT, THAT MEANS I CANNOT ANSWER THAT CLINICALLY.

I, AND THE REASON I'M ASKING IS JUST BECAUSE I, I WANNA UNDERSTAND, I KNOW, I KNOW THAT THE CAP PROGRAM HAS EXPANDED IN RECENT YEARS.

I THINK IT'S CLOSE TO 90,000 THAT'S IN THAT, I DON'T KNOW.

I THINK SOMEONE CAN CONFIRM WHAT THAT IS.

UM, AND, AND THAT'S INCREASED A LOT OVER THE LAST FEW YEARS, AND I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE INCOME LEVEL IS FOR THAT.

I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE'S SOME, SOME QUALIFIERS IF YOU RECEIVE CERTAIN ASSISTANCE, THEN YOU CAN AUTOMATICALLY QUALIFY FOR THAT.

UM, BUT IS THERE AN INCOME CUTOFF? AND IS IS IT LOW AND MODERATE OR IS IT LOW INCOME? AND WHAT DOES LOW AND MODERATE KIND OF MEAN? UNFORTUNATE, UNFORTUNATELY, AUSTIN ENERGY'S CUSTOMER ASSISTANCE PROGRAM DOES NOT INCOME QUALIFY.

THEY, UH, THEY DO HAVE A, A SECOND, THEY HAVE TWO WAYS TO PARTICIPATE.

ONE IS AUTOMATIC ENROLLMENT, AND THAT'S IF YOU'RE ON ONE OF, UH, MAYBE SEVEN, EIGHT SOCIAL SERVICE PROGRAMS SUCH AS, UH, UH, FOOD STAMPS OR, UH, UH, TELEPHONE ASSISTANCE.

AND THEN FOR SOME PEOPLE THAT FALL THROUGH THE CRACKS, THEY ALLOW THEM TO ACTUALLY INCOME QUALIFY, SENDING IN THEIR FINANCIAL, UH, INFORMATION, WHICH IS, UH, PRESUMABLY KEPT CONFIDENTIAL.

UH, A MINORITY OF, UH, CAP PARTICIPANTS.

WHEN I LOOKED AT THIS SEVERAL YEARS AGO, IT WAS ABOUT ONE OUT OF SIX, UH, INCOME QUALIFIED.

THE REST WERE AUTOMATICALLY ENROLLED.

AND THAT PART, THE, THE INCOME QUALIFYING, YES, THEY DO CLINICALLY LOOK AT IF YOU'RE OVER A CERTAIN AMOUNT, AND I THINK THAT'S ACTUALLY ON THEIR WEBSITE.

IF YOU'RE A TWO PERSON HOUSEHOLD, YOU CAN'T MAKE MORE THAN THIS.

UH, AND OF COURSE THAT CHANGES EVERY YEAR.

UM, I DO NOT KNOW WHAT THE CITY DEMOGRAPHER USED AS HER QUAL FOR LOW AND MODERATE INCOME.

I PRESUME IT'S THE SAME, UH, METRIC THAT AUSTIN ENERGY USED, BUT I DON'T KNOW IT.

COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN.

THERE IS A STANDARD DEFINITION OF LOW TO MODERATE INCOME.

IT WAS ESTABLISHED BY THE US DEPARTMENT OF HOUSING AND URBAN DEVELOPMENT.

THEY CONSIDER HOUSEHOLDS WITH TOTAL INCOMES OF 80% OR LESS OF THE AREA MEDIAN TO BE LOW OR MODERATE INCOME WITHIN THE STATE OF TEXAS.

APPROXIMATELY 42% OF ALL TEXANS ARE LOW TO MODERATE INCOME.

AS A PRACTICAL MATTER THAT IS ABOUT, UH, UH, FOR A FAMILY OF FOUR, THAT IS PROBABLY NO MORE THAN ABOUT $38,000 A YEAR.

THAT'S NOT A LOT OF CASH I JUST CAME FROM.

AND, AND, UM, MOST PEOPLE WHO WORK IN THE AREA OF ENERGY OF POVERTY AND ENERGY AFFORDABILITY CONSIDER AN ENERGY BURDEN, AN ELECTRICITY BURDEN, THE AMOUNT THAT YOU PAY OF YOUR INCOME

[01:30:01]

FOR ELECTRICITY BILL OF OVER 6% TO BE EXCESSIVE.

AND I AM GUESSING THAT I, I HAVE NOT RUN THESE ACTUAL NUMBERS.

I'M SURPRISED PAUL'S NOT WAY AHEAD OF ME ON IT, BUT THE TWO OF US, I'M SURE CAN FIGURE IT OUT.

I AM GUESSING THAT THE ENERGY BURDEN IN MOST OF THE DISTRICTS ON VICE CHAIR ROBIN'S SLIDE IS SIGNIFICANTLY HIGHER THAN BETWEEN, BETWEEN GAS AND ELECTRICITY ALONE.

IT'S PROBABLY WELL OVER EIGHT TO 10%.

I JUST CAME BACK FROM THE NORTH, THE CONFERENCE OF THE NORTH AMERICAN REGULATORY UTILITY COMMISSIONERS.

THERE'S A FUN BUNCH FOR YOU.

EVERYBODY IS TALKING ABOUT AFFORDABILITY AND NO ONE IS DOING ANYTHING ABOUT IT.

THIS IS SOMETHING WE COULD DO ABOUT IT HERE IN AUSTIN.

FOUR, OUR LOW INCOME CUSTOMERS, WE COULD ACTUALLY ADOPT RATES THAT WERE LOW ENOUGH TO RESTORE SOME, OH, THE OTHER THING I MEANT TO SAY IS ONE IN 7%, ONE IN SEVEN OF EVERY TEXANS TODAY IN THE LAST YEAR, HAS REPORTED THAT THEY HAVE BEEN DISCONNECTED FROM THEIR ELECTRIC SERVICE OR WERE AT RISK OF DISCONNECTION BECAUSE THEY COULDN'T PAY THE BILL BECAUSE THEIR BILLS WERE TOO HIGH.

THIS IS HOW WE ADDRESS THAT ISSUE, IS BY CHANGING THE RATES IN SUCH A WAY THAT THE PEOPLE WHO ARE MAKING, YOU'VE HEARD OF THE CASE, CASE K ECONOMY NOW, WHERE THE RICH PEOPLE ARE MAKING MORE.

AND THE, THE, AND, AND TEXAS HASN'T RAISED THE COST OF LIVING SINCE I THINK 2007.

THE MINIMUM WAGE.

COST OF LIVING HAS DEFINITELY CHANGED.

AND SO WE HAVE SEEN, UM, WITHIN THE STATE APPROXIMATELY 27 TO 30% INFLATION OF ELECTRICITY COSTS SINCE 2020 ALONE.

THIS IS HOW WE START TO ADDRESS THAT IN EQUITY.

AND THIS IS HOW WE START TO ADDRESS THE AFFORDABILITY PROBLEM HERE IN AUSTIN.

WE CAN'T CHANGE, UNFORTUNATELY, THE MINIMUM WAGE, BUT WE CAN DO SOMETHING ABOUT ELECTRICITY BURDEN FOR THE LOWEST INCOME DECK AUSTIN RESIDENTS.

AND THIS IS HOW WE DO IT.

COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, DO YOU WANT TO GET INTO YOUR RECOMMENDATION OR? YES.

UH, IF, IF COMMISSIONERS HAVE HAD THEIR QUESTIONS AND COMMENTS DEALT WITH, I HAVE MORE.

UH, UH, WE HAVE, UM, IT SEEMS SO OBVIOUS NOW.

UM, IT'S, IT SEEMS LIKE THAT, UH, THE PEOPLE USING, UH, THE MOST ENERGY ARE THE ONES, UH, WHO HAVE THE LARGEST HOUSES AS FAR AS RESIDENTS GO.

AND THEY'RE ALSO THE MOST WEALTHY PEOPLE.

AND THEY SHOULD BE HELPING THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE NO MONEY TO BE ABLE TO AFFORD THE, UH, THE ENERGY THAT THEY'RE BARELY USING.

IT SEEMS LIKE THE, THE, THE TIERED SYSTEM DEFINITELY NEEDS TO BE, UM, INTER UH, LOOKED AT REALLY HARD AND, AND, UH, I THINK, UH, COMMISSIONER ROBBINS IS, IS ON IT RIGHT NOW THAT, UH, WE DEFINITELY NEED TO REVIEW HOW, HOW IT IS THAT WE HELP PEOPLE AFFORD TO LIVE HERE.

AND, UM, THAT, THAT, THAT'S A THING THAT I THINK IS SYSTEM WIDE, NOT JUST WITH UTILITIES, BUT WITH, UH, TAXES.

AND, UH, YOU JUST, YOU COULD GO A LOT OF PLACES WITH, WITH THIS IDEA OF HOW IT IS, WE MAKE IT MORE EQUITABLE AND, AND, AND, UH, AND HAVE PEOPLE BE ABLE TO AFFORD TO LIVE.

SO I SUPPORT THIS, THIS IDEA WHOLEHEARTEDLY.

UH, THANK YOU.

UM, I'M GONNA ASSUME THAT, UM, WE CAN PUT UP THE RESOLUTION.

UH, IT, IT'S THE SECOND ONE IN THE PACKET.

IT'S ABOUT, UM, THIS GOES ABOUT A PAGE AND A AND A HALF RATHER THAN THE FIRST ONE, WHICH IS A PAGE AND A THIRD.

IS IT THE ACTUAL PACKET OR THIS ONE IN, IN THE ACTUAL PACKET? ITEM TWO.

RATE RECOMMENDATION REVISED TWO OF TWO.

YEAH, YEAH, YEAH.

REVISED.

AND, UM, FOR THE SAKE OF PUTTING IT ON THE TABLE, I'M GONNA MOVE APPROVAL.

AND IF THERE'S A SECOND, THEN SECOND WE CAN, WE CAN DISCUSS THIS OPEN FOR DISCUSSION.

DRUM ROLL PLEASE.

WE'LL JUST WORK OUR WAY, UH, UH, DOWN, UM, UH, WE'LL JUST JUMP AROUND TO, UM, COMMISSIONERS.

CAN, CAN WE MAGNIFY THAT PLEASE? IS IT POSSIBLE? UH, LET'S JUST START WITH THE BEGINNING AND

[01:35:01]

UM, I, ARE YOU SURE THIS IS CORRECT DOCUMENT? I THINK THE NEXT ONE, 'CAUSE IT SHOULD SAY IN THE RIGHT CORNER, REVISED TWO OF TWO.

UH, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN.

UM, UM, I, UH, HAVE TAKEN INPUT DIRECTLY FROM, UH, COMMISSIONERS, UH, SILVERSTEIN AND SCHWARTZ.

I HAVE INDIRECTLY TAKEN COMMENTS FROM CHAIR DAVIS AND TO, UH, AN EXTENT, UH, COMMISSIONER KENARD.

UH, IF OTHER PEOPLE WANT TO, UH, RECOMMEND, UH, ANY CHANGES, THIS IS THE TIME TO DO IT.

I HAVE A QUESTION.

UH, COMMISSION.

COMMISSIONER FARMER, UH, HOW DOES THIS WORK WITH REGARD TO AREAS WITHIN AUSTIN ENERGY SERVICE, UH, THAT ARE NOT PART OF THE CITY OF AUSTIN? THEY'RE NOT PART OF, SO LIKE WESTLAKE AND ROLLING WOOD AND, UH, SUNSET VALLEY AREAS THAT AUSTIN ENERGY PROVIDES ELECTRICITY TO BUT ARE NOT DISTRICTS? UM, I'M GOING FROM MEMORY HERE, BUT AS I RECALL, UH, AUSTIN ENERGY HAS ABOUT 14% OF ITS RESIDENTIAL CUSTOMERS LIVING OUTSIDE THE SERVICE AREA.

AND SINCE THEY GENERALLY USE MORE THAN AVERAGE, IT PROBABLY REPRESENTS MORE LIKE MAYBE 17 OR 18% OF VOLUME.

THIS IS A VERY ROUGH OFFHAND GUESS, AND THIS DOES NOT UNFORTUNATELY AFFECT, UH, UH, RATES OUTSIDE THE CITY.

UH, RATES OUTSIDE THE CITY HAVE THEIR OWN, UH, RESIDENTIAL, UH, THAT HAS THEIR, THEY HAVE THEIR OWN RATE STRUCTURE, UH, THAT'S MORE OR LESS, UH, BEEN, UH, AGREED TO.

UM, AND SO THIS RESOLUTION WOULD PERTAIN TO THE, TO THE, IN CITY RIGHTS.

I GUESS IT'S POSSIBLE THAT WE COULD RECOMMEND, UH, ALTERATIONS TO, UH, OUTOF CITY RATES, BUT IT'S A, IT'S KIND OF A DIFFERENT ANIMAL.

YEAH, I, I MEAN, I MEAN, IT'S NOT, I MEAN, I WAS JUST CURIOUS 'CAUSE IT SEEMS LIKE, YOU KNOW, THIS IS SORT OF LOOKING AT INCOME GAPS ACROSS DISTRICTS, AND IT SEEMS LIKE PROBABLY THE WEALTHIEST DISTRICTS ARE THE ONES THAT ARE NOT INCLUDED IN THIS BE, THAT ARE GONNA BE WESTLAKE AND ROLLING WOOD AND PLACES LIKE THAT, THAT ARE GONNA BE DISPROPORTIONATELY, UH, WEIGHTED.

UM, BUT ANYWAY, YEAH, I WAS JUST CURIOUS.

I MEAN, IT'S ALSO LIKE, DO WE, DOES THIS COUNCIL OR THIS COMMISSION HAVE, LIKE, I MEAN, I GUESS TECHNICALLY IF WE'RE WORKING WITH AUSTIN ENERGY AND AUSTIN ENERGY IS SERVING THOSE CUSTOMERS, EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE OUTSIDE OF THE CITY ANYWAY, ACT, ACTUALLY, CURIOUS, COMMISSIONER FARMER, THIS RESOLUTION DOES NOT, UH, DI DELINEATE BETWEEN IN CITY AND OUT OF CITY RIGHTS.

UM, UM, COULD COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, COULD YOU PLEASE LOOK UP THE, UH, RESIDENTIAL R RIGHT TARIFF REAL QUICK AND SEE HOW MANY TIERS ARE IN THE OUTTA CITY RATE? SHOULD BE RIGHT THERE IN THE TARIFF.

I I DO NOT HAVE A LAPTOP.

FOUR TIERS FOR THE ENERGY CHARGES.

IS THAT WHAT YOU WANTED? UH, YEAH.

AND AREN'T THE THIRD.

AND THEN OUT OF CITY, INSIDE CITY IS FOUR TIERS.

AND, UM, THEY'RE NOT GIVING ME OUT OF, IT SHOULD BE DOWN NOW OUTSIDE THE CITY.

DING, DING, DING.

FORTIS, UH, ARE THE LAST TWO TIERS THE SAME? YES.

UH, OVER 2000

[01:40:01]

KWHA MONTH.

THIS, THIS RESOLUTION, UH, DOESN'T DEFINE WHETHER IT'S FOR IN CITY OR OUT OF CITY.

SO, UH, I THINK WE CAN ASSUME THAT IT WOULD APPLY TO BOTH, UH, SETS OF CUSTOMERS.

IT LOOKS LIKE THEY'RE PRETTY IDENTICAL IN AND OUT OF, OF CITY.

JUST FROM A CURSORY LOOK, DOES THAT HELP YOU, UH, EASE, EASE YOUR MIND IN ANY WAY? I WAS JUST, I WAS JUST CURIOUS.

I THINK I'M, I'M GOOD WITH THIS AS IS.

I WAS JUST UNSURE OF HOW THAT ALL WENT DOWN.

UH, DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY, UM, UM, ALTERATIONS OR SUGGESTIONS? I WOULD LIKE TO, TO CHANGE THE WORDING FOR THE WHOLE RESOLUTION.

FOR THE WHOLE RESOLUTION.

I WOULD LIKE TO BRING UP THE, THE THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED CLAUSES SO WE CAN SEE WHAT IS BEING PROPOSED AT THE BOTTOM.

THAT'S IT.

GO UP JUST A LITTLE BIT, PLEASE.

WE DON'T HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO THAT ANYMORE.

UM, WOULD YOU MIND JUST, UM, READING IT INTO THE RECORD NOW? YEAH.

YOU DON'T HAVE TO READ THE WHOLE, BUT JUST LIKE SOME COMMENTARY ABOUT WHAT THIS PROPOSAL DOES.

UH, FIRST THERE'S THREE POINTS.

ONE, IT RESTRUCTURES THE RESIDENTIAL RATE INCREASE BETWEEN 2025 AND 2026 TO BE MORE PROGRESSIVE, UH, BY PLACING AN EQUAL MULTIPLIER ON ALL RATE COMPONENTS.

UH, CURRENTLY, THEY, UH, ONLY INCREASE THE CUSTOMER CHARGE IN TIER ONE, AND THIS WOULD INCREASE ALL COMPONENTS THE CUSTOMER CHARGE, TIER ONE, TIER TWO, TIER THREE, AND TIER FOUR BY THE SAME INCREASE.

AND THIS WILL EQUALIZE, UH, RATES ACROSS COUNCIL DISTRICTS.

UM, UH, AND, AND THE RATE INCREASE, NOT ACTUAL RATES.

THIS WILL THANK YOU.

THIS, THIS WILL DECREASE.

THIS WILL EQUALIZE THE RATE INCREASE ACROSS ALL COUNCIL DISTRICTS.

UH, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN ADDED A CLAUSE.

THE WORK STILL NEEDS TO OCCUR TO REMEDY THE REGRESSIVE RATE ACTIONS THAT TOOK PLACE PRIOR TO THIS.

SECOND, IT REQUIRES THAT ALL FUTURE PROPOSED RATE INCREASES HAVE AN ACCOMPANYING ANALYSIS THAT EXHIBITS RATE INCREASES FOR EACH COUNCIL DISTRICT.

IT SHOULD NOT BE FOR THE VICE CHAIR OF A COMMISSION TO COME UP WITH THIS EVERY SINGLE TIME.

UH, AUSTIN ENERGY SHOULD PROVIDE THIS ROUTINELY SO COUNCIL MEMBERS CAN MAKE INFORMED DECISIONS.

AND FINALLY, WE NEED TO BEGIN AN EVIDENTIARY RAPE CASE THIS YEAR TO ALLOW CITIZENS AND STAKEHOLDERS THE POWER OF DISCOVERY AND TESTIMONY IN ACCORDANCE WITH CITY OF AUSTIN.

CUSTOM, UH, OUR PURVIEW ON RATES, UH, THE RESOURCE MANAGEMENT COMMISSION'S PURVIEW IS LIMITED.

WE CAN COMMENT ON THE RATE STRUCTURES.

WE CAN'T COMMENT MOSTLY ON THE RATES PER SE, BUT WE CAN AS INDIVIDUALS JOIN, UH, AT LEAST IF WE, THE RATE CASES IN 2012 AND 2016.

AND 2022 REALLY ALLOWED ANYBODY WHO WAS A STAKEHOLDER TO BE AN INTERVENOR.

NOW THAT, NOW THAT NOT THAT MANY PEOPLE BECAME INTERVENORS BECAUSE WHEN THEY REALIZED HOW DAUNTING THE TASK WAS, THEY MOSTLY DROPPED OUT.

BUT, SO IT'S KIND OF SELF-LIMITING TO WHERE ONLY THE SERIOUS WILL STAY.

BUT THIS IS THE KIND OF THING THAT WE NEED TO CONTINUE.

UH, AND I'LL GIVE YOU ONE EXAMPLE OF WHY IN THE 2022 RATE CASE, UH, ONE OF THE INTERVENERS FOUND $9.3 MILLION IN DOUBLE COUNTY, WHICH AUSTIN ENERGY AGREED WAS A PROBLEM, AND THEY LOWERED RATES ACCORDINGLY.

WELL,

[01:45:01]

WE DO NOT HAVE THE POWER OF DISCOVERY.

SO WE NEED TO GET THAT BACK.

AND THAT'S WHY I PUT THIS, UH, I, I, THAT'S WHY THIS THIRD POINT IS IN THE RESOLUTION.

I'M GONNA TRY TO, UM, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, YOU KNOW, NOT WHAT YOU HAVE DONE.

, UH, THE, THE PERSON IN CHARGE OF AV GAVE ME THAT MICROPHONE BECAUSE I WOULDN'T HAVE TO DAVE CONSTANTLY TURN IT ON AND OFF AGAIN.

AND NOW HE'S GOING TO BE GOING CRAZY.

IT'S GONNA BEHAVE FOR ME.

THANK YOU, MR. RUSHER.

UM, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, I, I WANT TO EMPHASIZE THAT THE EFFECT OF THIS PROPOSAL IS REALLY VERY LIMITED.

THIS IS NOT A FULL RESTRUCTURING OF ALL OF THE RATES IN THE DIRECTION THAT SOME OF US WOULD LIKE TO ACHIEVE.

TRUE TRULY PROGRESSIVE RATES.

ALL THIS DOES, IF YOU LOOK AT WHERE, BE IT RESOLVED ITEM ONE, ALL WE ARE PROPOSING TO DO IS CHANGE THE WAY THE CURRENT RATE INCREASE IS ALLOCATED.

THAT'S A LITTLE TEENY BIT OF A BIG WHOLE RATE STRUCTURE THAT JUST CHANGES AROUND THE MARGIN, WHAT THE CURRENT RATE STRUCTURE IS.

SO THERE IS A LOT MORE WORK TO DO IF WE AS A COMMISSION WANTED TO USE TO RATE DESIGN AS A WAY TO PURSUE AND ENCOURAGE INCREASED CONSERVATION, WHICH IS THE POINT OF OUR COMMISSION AND, AND OUR REMIT IS TO ENCOURAGE BETTER USE OF ENERGY.

ALL THIS DOES IS NUDGE RATES A LITTLE BIT ACCORDING TO THE AMOUNT OF THIS CURRENT RATE INCREASE, WHICH IS, WE ARE TOLD ONLY 5% INCREASE ON TOTAL CURRENT RATES.

SO THERE IS A GIGANTIC POOL OF MONEY OUT THERE THAT, AND THAT IS IN RATES THAT WE ARE NOT ABLE TO TOUCH AND THAT WE ARE NOT TRYING TO TOUCH THROUGH THIS RESOLUTION.

UH, COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ? YES.

UH, REALLY WELL SAID.

UH, COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, I JUST WANTED TO ECHO THAT.

SO BASICALLY WHAT THE, THE ASK AS I READ IT IS ASKING FOR IS TO PUT THE STRUCTURE BACK TO WHAT IT WAS, I GUESS IN OCTOBER OR SEPTEMBER IN TERMS OF THE PROGRESSIVE OR AGGRESSIVENESS OF THE SHAPE OF THE CURVE.

IT'S NOT REALLY, YOU KNOW, ACCOMPLISHING US CHANGING THINGS TO MAKE THEM MORE PROGRESSIVE.

JUST IF THE RATE INCREASE WENT THROUGH AS PROPOSED, IT WOULD MAKE THE CURRENT RATES MORE REGRESSIVE, RIGHT? YEAH.

ALL WE WANNA DO IS KEEP THE SLOPE THE SAME, RIGHT? YEAH.

AT, IN TERMS OF WHERE IT IS TODAY WITH THE CURRENT RATE INCREASE.

A BIT HARDER AND TALK TO OUR ACTUAL COUNSEL REPRESENTATIVES ABOUT THIS IDEA.

AND I GUESS, SO MY FOLLOW UP IS I APPRECIATE, PAUL, YOU TURNING ALL THE, THE, IT, IT WAS, IT'S REALLY INTERESTING TO SEE IT BROKEN DOWN BY COUNCIL DISTRICT, AND I THINK YOU DID A GOOD JOB MAKING, YOU KNOW, 0.1 AND THE BE IT RESOLVED CLEAR THAT WE JUST WANT A EVEN MULTIPLIER THAT IT'S SORT OF A SIMPLE CONCEPT TO RETURN, YOU KNOW, TO THE SAME SHAPE THAT WE WERE LAST YEAR.

UH, AND THEN, YEAH, THE, THE SECOND THING I WANTED TO NOTE WAS THAT I WASN'T AN INTERVENER IN 22, BUT I WAS INVOLVED WITH A GROUP OF FOLKS THAT WENT TO COUNCIL DURING THE RATE CASE, AND THERE WAS AN ORDER OF MAGNITUDE OR MAYBE EVEN TWO ORDERS OF MAGNITUDE MORE COMMUNITY INPUT ON, IN 22 ON THE AUSTIN ENERGY RATE CASE AND ALL, AND ALL THAT.

SO, UM, I SUPPORT, I GUESS IT WAS POINTS TWO OR THREE WITH, UH, ASKING THEM TO CONTINUE DOING THIS 0.3 0.3 SO THE CITY CAN, THE CITY, AND REALLY THE COMMUNITY AND THE, THE PROCESS OF IT, I THINK JUST BRINGS MORE PEOPLE INTO THE FOLD AND, UH, ALLOWS THE, YOU KNOW, NOT JUST RMC, BUT THE WHOLE COMMUNITY TO, UH, BE AWARE THAT THIS IS EVEN HAPPENING.

I MEAN, WE, WE WEREN'T EVEN AWARE THIS IS HAPPENING, RIGHT? AND I KNOW, I GUESS THE EEC, YOU KNOW, MAYBE ON SOME LEVEL THEY WERE MORE AWARE THAN US, BUT I, FROM WHAT I HAVE HEARD ABOUT IT, I GUESS THEY WERE LESS AWARE THAN, MUCH LESS AWARE AND SORT OF PART OF THE PROCESS THAN THEY HAD BEEN IN THE PAST.

SO, UH, THANKS FOR INCLUDING THAT TOO.

I THINK THAT'S A, A GOOD SUGGESTION FOR US.

COMMISSIONER LUKI, UH, THIS COMMISSION AND ALL COMMISSIONS HAVE ONE POWER ONLY, AND THAT IS THE POWER OF SUGGESTION.

I SUGGEST THAT WE PURSUE THIS A

[01:50:01]

PERSONALLY, THIS FEELS LIKE A FRONT PAGE STORY.

HONESTLY, IF THE RIGHT JOURNALIST WOULD, UH, APPROACH THIS IDEA, IT SEEMS LIKE SOMETHING THAT EVERYONE WOULD BE INTERESTED IN THAT WE ABSOLUTELY HAVE NO CLUE HOW ANY OF THIS WORKS.

ME SITTING ON THIS COMMISSION, I'M BARELY STARTING TO FIGURE IT OUT MYSELF, AND I'VE BEEN HERE FOR A YEAR, SO, UH, I FEEL LIKE WE'VE KIND OF BEEN SNOOKERED HERE.

, HONESTLY, I FEEL LIKE WE HAVE, I FEEL LIKE THERE, THERE'S BEEN A, A SLEIGH OF HAND THAT'S OCCURRED, AND, UH, I DON'T APPRECIATE IT AT ALL.

I'M KIND OF UPSET ABOUT IT, TO TELL YOU THE TRUTH.

UM, GO AHEAD, LISA, IF YOU ARE LISTENING TO THIS, I, I, I HOPE, I HOPE THAT YOU HEARD HIM.

I MIGHT WANNA SWITCH THAT MICROPHONE BACK.

BUT THAT INCREASES UNCERTAINTY.

UH, I'M ABOUT TO SAY SOMETHING UNPOPULAR.

UM, I'M NOT GOING TO VOTE FOR THIS RECOMMENDATION, AND I JUST WANNA SAY WHY.

UM, FEW REASONS.

NUMBER ONE, THE BY WAY OF BACKGROUND, UH, THE EUC DID ACTUALLY CONSIDER SOMETHING VERY SIMILAR TO WHAT'S PROPOSED IN ITEM ONE.

UH, BACK IN AUGUST, THEY DID NOT PASS, UH, THAT RECOMMENDATION.

THERE WAS A LOT OF DISCUSSION ABOUT IT.

YOU CAN GO THROUGH AND WATCH THE RECORDING.

I DID WATCH IT, AND ONE OF THE THINGS I LEARNED WAS THAT, UM, THERE'S A LOT MORE THAT GOES INTO THE FINANCIAL ANALYSIS ABOUT MAKING UP THE GAP, RIGHT? THERE'S THIS REGULATORY LAG, EVEN WITH THE INCREASE THAT THEY PUSH THROUGH BACK IN NOVEMBER, THERE'S STILL A $43 MILLION DEFICIT, UM, IN OUR MUNICIPAL UTILITY.

AND, UH, IT, IT SEEMS VERY SIMPLE TO SAY, OH, WE NEED 5%, LET'S PUT 5% ON THE BASE RATE AND ON ALL OF THE TIERS AND GET 5%.

YOU DON'T KNOW EXACTLY HOW MUCH USAGE YOU'RE GOING TO GET.

THAT INCREASE MIGHT NEED TO BE A LOT MORE THAN FIVE TO ACCOUNT FOR THAT UNCERTAINTY.

I DON'T KNOW IF IT WOULD BE 6, 8, 12, 13.

I, I'M NOT SURE WHAT IT WOULD BE.

I'M NOT SURE IF THEY DID THAT ANALYSIS.

I WOULD HOPE THAT THEY DID.

UM, BUT I, I, I FEAR THAT IT'S TOO SIMPLISTIC TO SAY LET'S PASS, UH, YOU KNOW, A FLAT INCREASE ACROSS ALL THE TIERS.

I'M ON RECORD, UH, HAS, UH, SUPPORTING PROGRESSIVE RATES ON THIS COMMISSION ON THE JSC THAT I SIT ON.

I ABSOLUTELY SUPPORT PROGRESSIVE RATES, UM, AND CONSERVATION.

THAT'S WHY I'M HERE.

UM, BUT I'M NOT SURE THAT, I'M NOT CONVINCED THAT THIS IS THE WAY TO DO THAT.

POINT NUMBER TWO, I'M ALL FOR SEEING WHAT, WHAT FUTURE RATE INCREASES LOOK LIKE ACROSS DISTRICTS.

I THINK THAT'S IMPORTANT INFORMATION FOR COUNCIL MEMBERS TO HAVE.

UM, AND THEN ON THE THIRD POINT, THE, IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT THE FINANCIAL POLICIES OF AUSTIN ENERGY DO REQUIRE, UM, RATE REVIEWS EVERY FIVE YEARS.

THE LAST ONE, HAVING BEEN IN 2022, MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT THERE IS A, UM, THERE IS A PLAN TO USE 2026 AS THE TEST YEAR FOR THE NEXT, UM, FOR, FOR THE NEXT CASE.

SO THAT'S WHAT MY EXPECTATION WOULD BE.

AND THEN FINALLY AROUND, UM, YOU KNOW, WE TALK ABOUT LOW INCOME CUSTOMERS AND CAP CUSTOMERS.

UM, WELL, I THINK THAT THERE HAS BEEN A TON OF PROGRESS IN GETTING PEOPLE INTO THAT PROGRAM.

UM, THERE'S OBVIOUSLY, THERE'S STILL A LONG WAY TO GO.

WE STILL HAVE 30% OR SO THAT THAT COULD QUALIFY BUT AREN'T IN THAT PROGRAM.

SO I WOULD DEFINITELY BE SUPPORTIVE OF, UH, A BIG PUSH TO TRY TO GET MORE, UH, OF THOSE, UH, CUSTOMERS INTO THAT PROGRAM.

THE, THE CAP CUSTOMERS DO NOT PAY THE, THE CUSTOMER CHARGE.

SO WHEN THAT GETS RAISED FROM 15 TO 16, 50 TO 18 TO 20, WHATEVER THEY RAISE IT TO, THEY'RE PROTECTED FROM THAT.

AND I THINK THAT'S A GOOD THING.

SO I, I WOULD RATHER SEE A LOT MORE PUSH INTO EXPANDING THAT, UH, POOL, UH, TO, YOU KNOW, PRO PROTECT THOSE CUSTOMERS, UM, THEN, YOU KNOW, SAYING, LET'S, LET'S PUT A FLAT MULTIPLIER ACROSS ALL THE TIER AND BE DONE WITH IT.

SO THAT'S, THAT'S KIND OF WHERE I AM.

I JUST WANTED TO SAY THAT, SO IT DIDN'T SEEM AS A SURPRISE WHEN I DON'T VOTE FOR IT.

UM, I SAW COMMISSIONER COOK.

UM, I, LIKE, I DON'T REALLY UNDERSTAND RATE MAKING AND I, BUT I DO KNOW THAT IT'S A VERY COMPLICATED PROCESS AND IT DOES SEEM LIKE TOUGH TO, TO DO LIKE A 5% ACROSS THE BOARD, UH, INCREASE.

UM, HONESTLY, I FEEL KIND OF SIMILAR IN THAT,

[01:55:01]

ALTHOUGH I ALSO DO DEFINITELY SUPPORT PROGRESSIVE RATE MAKING.

I ALSO FEEL LIKE IT'S KIND OF LIKE, YOU KNOW, AE IS NOT GIVING US THE TOOLS BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE, YOU KNOW, LIKE NOT TO, UM, TWO AND THREE HERE.

IT'S LIKE WE DO NOT HAVE THE TOOLS TO, TO INTERROGATE THAT.

AND, YOU KNOW, WE DO, WE ARE IN A REGULATED UTILITY, AND SO IT IS A, IS KIND OF A MONOLITH THAT IS NOT ALWAYS OPEN TO, OR A DEMOCRATIC ABOUT HOW THEY, UM, PROVIDE INFORMATION AND DISTRIBUTE IT AND ALLOW US INPUT INTO IT.

AND SO I THINK IT IS KIND OF, THEY PUT US IN A VERY TOUGH POSITION WHEN IT COMES TO THESE, LIKE SAYING, LIKE, WHAT I, I'M JUST KIND OF LIKE BACK AND FORTH ABOUT HOW ACTUALLY VALUABLE IS IT TO SAY WE SUPPORT PROGRESSIVE RATE STRUCTURE, MAKE A BETTER, MORE PROGRESSIVE RATE STRUCTURE, BUT WE CAN'T SAY ANYTHING MORE DETAILED BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT GIVING US ANY MORE INFORMATION.

SO I'M NOT REALLY, I'M NOT SURE WHERE TO GO WITH THAT, BUT I DO WANNA LIKE, SAY THAT I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF, UH, DEMOCRATIZATION OF THIS UTILITY THAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN FOR US TO LIKE ACTUALLY HAVE A MORE IMPACTFUL, LIKE REGULATORY OVERSIGHT ROLE.

AROUND WHO IS PAYING THAT MONEY INTO THE FUND.

UH, VICE CHAIR ROBBINS, UH, JUST TO, UH, CLARIFY, CAP CUSTOMERS DON'T HAVE A CUSTOMER CHARGE, BUT THEY DO HAVE A TIER ONE CHARGE, AND THAT DID GO UP.

SO IT'S NOT LIKE, UH, CAP CUSTOMERS ARE BEING SPARED.

UH, AND I WILL ADMIT THAT THERE'S AT LEAST SOME AMOUNT OF, UH, I, I'D HATE TO CALL IT BIAS, UH, ON MY PART, BUT CERTAINLY A LEANING.

UM, I STARTED OUT MY ALLEGED CAREER, UH, FIGHTING NUCLEAR PLANTS AND WATCHED THE NUCLEAR PLANT, UH, GO UP 460% IN THE SPAN OF FOUR YEARS AS AUSTIN ENERGY, FORMERLY KNOWN AS THE AUSTIN ELECTRIC DEPARTMENT, TRIED TO JUSTIFY IT.

AND THAT BAPTISM AND FIRE HAS, UH, CONDITIONED ME TO, UM, BE SOMEWHAT SKEPTICAL OF, UH, SOME THINGS THAT THEY SAY AND DO, UH, PARTICULARLY WHEN THEY BYPASS OUR COMMISSION.

UH, THERE WERE THREE VICE PRESIDENTS IN OF AUSTIN ENERGY IN THE ROOM IN 2022 WHEN WE PASSED A, UH, OUR, OUR COMMENTS ON A PROGRESSIVE RATE STRUCTURE.

AND AUSTIN ENERGY KNEW PRETTY WELL THAT, UH, WE HAD THAT INTEREST, AND YET THE DATE DID NOT COME TO OUR COMMISSION.

AND, UM, I, I AM, UM, AS BOTHERED BY IT AS, UH, COMMISSIONER LUKI IS COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN.

THANK YOU, UM, TO ADDRESS ONE OF YOUR CONCERNS, MADAM CHAIR, THE, I UNDERSTAND THE CONCERNS ABOUT AUSTIN ENERGY'S SHORTFALL AND, AND WHAT IS THE RIGHT NUMBER AND, AND, AND THE DIFFICULTIES OF FORECASTING WHAT REVENUES ARE.

AND THAT IS SOMETHING THAT HAPPENS TO EVERY UTILITY, UM, INCLUDING UTILITIES THAT, THAT ARE MUNICIPALS THAT PAY A SIGNIFICANT CHUNK OF THEIR, UM, PROFIT INTO A CITY'S MUNICIPAL, UM, BUDGET EVERY YEAR.

BUT WITH RESPECT TO, YOU SAID WHATEV, WHETHER IT'S 5% OR WHATEVER THE, THEIR, THEIR JOB IS TO RUN THE MATH, OUR PROPOSAL DOES NOT, WOULD NOT CHANGE WHETHER IT'S 5% OR 18% THAT THEY'RE ASKING FOR.

ALL WE ARE ASKING FOR.

SO IT WON'T CHANGE.

OUR PROPOSAL SHOULD BE REVENUE NEUTRAL, WHATEVER THEY ARE ASKING FOR RIGHT NOW, WE ARE LOOKING AT SUCH A SMALL SLICE OF THEIR BUDGET, WHETHER THEY HAVE FORECASTED ACCURATELY OR NOT, THAT THE REVENUE IMPACT SHOULD BE OF THIS PROPOSAL SHOULD BE COMPLETELY NEUTRAL.

AND ALL IT WILL DO IS MOVE

[02:00:01]

IT WILL NOT AFFECT, UM, BECAUSE IT IS SUCH A SMALL MARGINAL AMOUNT, IT WON'T HAVE ANY MEANINGFUL IMPACT ON HOW MUCH ELECTRICITY PEOPLE CONSUME OR HOW MUCH MONEY AUSTIN ENERGY COLLECTS.

UH, COMMISSIONER SCHWARZ.

YEAH, I WAS JUST WONDERING IF IT, IF PUTTING THAT, I, I THINK THE REVENUE NEUTRALITY OF IT IS CLEAR FROM THE FIRST PAGE OR AT LEAST SOMEWHAT IMPLIED FROM THE FIRST PAGE.

BUT I WAS WONDERING IF PUTTING THAT IN THE BE IT RESOLVED WOULD HELP FOLKS.

I MEAN, I, WHAT I, WHAT I TOOK FROM YOUR PROPOSAL, PAUL, WAS THAT IT WAS SURPRISINGLY UNPRESCRIPTIVE, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT ASKING THEM TO, TO CHANGE THE SHAPE BY A CERTAIN NUMBER OR A CERTAIN AMOUNT.

IT'S JUST TO CHANGE THE SHAPE, YOU KNOW, TO MAINTAIN THE SAME SHAPE THAT THEY HAD LAST YEAR, REALLY.

RIGHT.

SO I, I'M WONDERING IF IT COULD BE REWARDED TO KIND OF EMPHASIZE THE LACK OF PRESCRIPTIVE ASK, OR MAYBE JUST TO, TO EMPHASIZE THE REVENUE NEUTRALITY OF IT, THAT WE'RE NOT, YOU KNOW, TRYING TO CHANGE THE, YOU KNOW, WHAT THEIR LIKELIHOOD OF ACHIEVING THEIR, THEIR REVENUE REQUIREMENT.

UH, COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ, UH, IF YOU WANT TO, UH, COME UP WITH A A HALF SENTENCE THAT, UH, SAYS THAT I'D REALLY, UH, I'D BE FINE WITH IT.

UH, AND, UH, OR COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, IF, IF YOU WANT TO DO IT.

UM, THE POINT IS JUST TO GET THIS PASSED AND TO GET US OUT OF HERE BEFORE MIDNIGHT MM-HMM .

UH, AND REGARDING, UM, UM, YOU KNOW, COMMISSIONER DAVIS, YOU WARNED ME IN ADVANCE THAT YOU, MADAM CHAIR CHAIR DAVIS , UH, YOU WARNED ME IN ADVANCE THAT YOU PROBABLY WOULD NOT VOTE FOR THIS.

SO I'M NOT DISAPPOINTED, BUT I WILL HAVE, YOU KNOW, THAT I CHANGED 0.1 TO SPECIFICALLY ADDRESS SOME OF YOUR CONCERNS.

IF MS. GOODWIN IS READY TO TAKE NOTES ON, AND MS. EVERHART ON A PROPOSED LANGUAGE CHANGE, I SUGGEST THAT WE MODIFY, BE IT RESOLVED, NUMBER ONE TO AFTER RESTRUCTURE THE RESIDENTIAL RATE INCREASE BETWEEN 2025 AND 2026, DELETE THE PHRASE TO BE MORE PROGRESSIVE.

AND THEN AFTER THE END OF THE, THIS SENTENCE, CUSTOMER CHARGE IN TIER ONE, INSERT A NEW SENTENCE THAT READS, THIS WOULD BE A REVENUE NEUTRAL, REVENUE NEUTRAL CHANGE.

ARE YOU MOVING TO AMEND THE RECOMMENDATION OF THAT? YES, PLEASE.

THIS IS A FRIENDLY AMENDMENT.

IT'S A VERY FRIENDLY AMENDMENT.

OH, I, IS THERE A, THERE'S THIS, THERE'S A MOTION AND A SECOND TO ADOPT THE AMENDMENT.

IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION ON THAT AMENDMENT? DID YOU ALL GET IT? THANK YOU.

UH, WE CAN VOTE ON THE LANGUAGE CHANGE.

SO ALL IN FAVOR OF THE AMENDMENT THAT COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN JUST READ TO 0.1 OF THE, THEREFORE BE IT RESOLVED PORTION, PLEASE RAISE YOUR HAND.

ALL OPPOSED, ABSTAIN, UH, THAT AMENDMENT PASSES.

7 0 1.

I'M SORRY.

YES, WE DO STILL NEED THAT.

UM, UNLESS THERE ARE ANY OTHER, UM, AMENDMENTS, UH, MAY I, UH, CALL THE QUESTION ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? OKAY.

UM, SO NOW WE'RE GONNA VOTE ON THE RECOMMENDATION.

UH, ALL IN FAVOR OF THE RECOMMENDATION, PLEASE RAISE YOUR HANDS.

SEVEN.

ALL OPPOSED, UH, RECOMMENDATION PASSES.

CONGRATULATIONS.

AND I TRIED SO HARD, .

OKAY, THAT'S 7 1 0 OR 7 7 1 1 OR 7 1 0 7 4 1 AGAINST.

[5. Discussion on time of use rates and demand response.]

UM, LAST ITEM IS DISCUSSION ITEM, WHICH IS THE TIME OF USE RATES AND DEMAND RESPONSE.

[02:05:01]

UM, THIS ONE WAS, WAS BROUGHT BY COMMISSIONER FARMER.

SO DO YOU WANT TO CONTINUE LEAD THAT DISCUSSION HERE? UM, I THINK, I MEAN GIVEN MM-HMM .

UM, WITHOUT OBJECTION, I'LL MOVE TO FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS. WOULD YOU LIKE TO PUT THAT FOR CONSIDERATION FOR FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS? OKAY.

[FUTURE AGENDA ITEMS]

SO WE'LL ROLL THAT ONE OVER TO NEXT MEETING.

, CAN I, UM, MAKE A CONSTRUCTIVE SUGGESTION THAT YOU PERHAPS BY THE NEXT MEETING YOU MIGHT HAVE SOME DRAFT WORDING? YEAH, DRAFT WORDING.

WE DON'T HAVE TO VOTE ON IT NEXT DAY.

COMMISSIONER SILVERSTEIN, I KNOW YOU HAD SOME ITEMS THAT YOU WANTED TO SEE.

ONE, I'M CERTAIN IS THE DISTRICT ENERGY AND COOLING.

HEY, MS. EVERHART, HOW'S THAT GOING? ? UM, WE'LL LET YOU KNOW WHEN WE KNOW.

AND, AND, UM, MS. GOODWIN FORWARDED TO YOU THIS AFTERNOON, MY EMAIL ABOUT, UM, THERE WAS A VERY GOOD ARTICLE ON DROUGHTS AND, AND, UM, WITH SOME QUESTIONS FOR OUR FRIENDS AT, AT AUSTIN WATER ABOUT DROUGHT STRATEGY.

I AM HAPPY TO HAVE THEM BRING THAT BACK.

I WILL NOT BE HERE FOR THE MARCH MEETING, JUST NOTIFYING Y'ALL NOW.

UM, AND, AND SO I ASKED IT, IT BE BROUGHT UP IN APRIL, BUT MR. KLUGE WILL BE BACK IN MAY WITH HIS QUARTERLY BRIEFING.

SO I DOUBT THAT IT'S GONNA GET A LOT WETTER BETWEEN NOW AND THEN.

AND I AM WILLING, HAPPY TO HAVE THAT ON THE MAY AGENDA RATHER THAN THE APRIL AGENDA, BUT JUST LETTING EVERYBODY KNOW, LET'S NOT DO IT IN MARCH.

FAIR ENOUGH.

OTHER ITEMS? UH, YES.

VICE CHAIR.

UH, ISN'T GREEN CHOICE ABOUT TO BE UPDATED? ? YES.

GREEN CHOICE NOW INCLUDES SOLAR.

UH, AND I BELIEVE IF I READ CORRECTLY, THAT MAY WAS THEY WERE THE GREEN, THE GREEN BUILDING PROGRAM WAS GOING TO BE TAKING, UH, COMMENTS ON HOW TO UPDATE IT.

YES, THAT'S CORRECT.

CORRECT.

UM, I WOULD LIKE TO HAVE THIS ON OUR APRIL OR MAY MEETING SO THAT, UH, COMMISSIONERS CAN, UH, COMMENT MM-HMM .

GREEN CHOICE, UH, ON, I'M SORRY.

IT'S BEEN A LONG MEETING AND I MAY, DID I SAY GREEN CHOICE AT THE BEGINNING? YOU SAID OKAY, THEN I, IT'S MY ERROR.

YOU SAID GREEN CHOICE AT THE, AND I APOLOGIZE.

TO MAYBE COME UP WITH SOME ITEMS, I THINK THAT WOULD BE GOOD.

UH, THIS HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH GREEN CHOICE.

IT'S GREEN BUILDING.

FORGIVE ME NOW, NOW THAT WE'VE ESTABLISHED MY ERROR, I BELIEVE THAT GREEN BUILDING, UH, IS ASKING FOR COMMENTS ON HOW IT'S GOING TO BE REVISED FOR THE NEXT THREE OR FOUR YEARS.

AND I THINK APRIL OR MAY WOULD BE A GOOD TIME FOR OUR COMMISSION TO MAKE COMMENTS IF WE HAVE THEM NOTED.

UM, ONE OTHER THING I WANTED TO, UH, YES, IT WAS JUST THE AGENDA.

GO AHEAD.

OH, YEAH, I WAS A AGENDA TOPIC.

UM, EVERY YEAR THE, THE CITY TAKES, UH, RECOMMENDATIONS FROM BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS FOR BUDGET ITEMS. AND MARCH 31ST IS THE DEADLINE FOR BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS TO SUBMIT, UH, BUDGET RECOMMENDATIONS.

SO, UM, KIND OF BEHIND, BUT FOR NEXT MEETING, I'D LIKE TO AT LEAST HAVE A PLACEHOLDER FOR BUDGET RECOMMENDATIONS.

AND I THINK, UM, IT MAY BEHOOVE US TO, TO THINK ABOUT, UM, SOME AREAS THAT, YOU KNOW, ARE UNDER OUR, SORT OF OUR SCOPE THAT WE'D LIKE THE CITY TO INVEST IN.

IT COULD BE AROUND CONSERVATION, INCENTIVES, REBATES, UM, YOU KNOW, THINGS OF THAT NATURE.

UM, AND IF SOME FOLKS WANNA GET INTO SMALL SUB QUORUM GROUPS

[02:10:01]

I'D BE WILLING TO, UM, PARTICIPATE IN THAT.

PROBABLY DON'T HAVE THE BANDWIDTH TO LEAD IT, BUT, UM, BUT I JUST WANTED TO PUT THAT OUT THERE AS A, AS, UM, AN OPPORTUNITY FOR US TO ALSO, YOU KNOW, GET HEARD IN FRONT OF COUNSEL FOR BUDGET ITEMS. ARE YOU JUST WAITING FOR ME TO FINISH? UH, NO, I'M, UM, YOU'RE LOOKING AT ME.

UH, HE, HE'S WAVED HIS HAND A COUPLE TIMES AND HE WAS ALL, HE ALSO TRIED, UH, COMMISSIONER SCHWARTZ TRIED VAINLY TO GET SOMETHING ON THIS AGENDA, BUT HE WAS TOO LATE.

SO MAYBE HE COULD GET THAT ITEM ON IN MARCH.

YEAH, THAT'S ALL I WAS, GO AHEAD, BRING UP THE VALUE, VALUE OF SOLAR ACTION ITEM, IF WE COULD PUT THAT ON MARCH.

GOT THAT.

AND ACTUALLY HAD A QUESTION, SO WAS THERE A PRESENTATION THAT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE HAD TODAY THAT WAS CANCELED, OR WAS THAT JUST, DID, WAS IT JUST PUT ON THE AGENDA TODAY? AND THAT WAS NEVER REALLY PLANNED.

WE DID HAVE IT AS A PLACEHOLDER, BUT IT, I THINK IT WASN'T READY YET.

SO IT DIDN'T MAKE THIS AGENDA.

SO THIS IS A SEPARATE ITEM, LIKE FOR, UH, VALUE OF SOLAR RELATED ACTION.

ANYTHING ELSE? ALRIGHT, WITHOUT OBJECTION.

COOL.

I'LL TAKE A MOTION TO ADJOURN.

SO MOVED, SECONDED BY KENARD.